Editing files using Beat Matching Technique -Sound Forge - PC

Subject:Editing files using Beat Matching Technique Posted by: cyberbeat Date:2/5/2016 1:34:13 PM Mostly I edit dance/club and hip-hop where if I remove a portion of a song, the beats need to absolutely 100% still line up exactly after making a cut. So With that in mind, below is my method of doing this, but I'm looking for other and/or better ways to do these kinds of edits. First I set the beginning and end of the portion I want to remove and then adjust the selection by looking at the beats and making sure to use zero crossings. I'll listen to it a few times in loop mode 'til it sounds good and finally cut the selection to the clipboard Just to be sure I got the beats perfect I'll bring up the Mix dialog and play it to see if what I cut mixes along perfectly in synch with the existing audio. If not, I press escape to close the Mix dialog, hit Ctrl+z for undo adjust the selection and repeat the process. When I finally get it right the results are spot on! My question is though, there's got to be an easier and faster way to do this. Especially when trying to Mix-Paste. As I said the only reason I do this Mix part is to be sure that the portion I cut is so I can tell the beats are still lined up even after the cut is made. how do others do this type of beat-critical type of editing? Can't wait to read your responses and sory for such a long post! Thanks.==Steve Message last edited on2/5/2016 6:19:17 PM bycyberbeat.
Subject:RE: Editing files using Beat Matching Technique Reply by: ChristoC Date:2/5/2016 8:37:22 PM SoundForge is rather cumbersome for what you are doing; I suggest looking at Sony ACID = http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/musicstudio which is built to do what you are wanting to do, and editing can be achieved on separate tracks - download the Demo first.
Subject:RE: Editing files using Beat Matching Technique Reply by: Chienworks Date:2/5/2016 9:03:19 PM I do this in Sound Forge often. What i start with is placing markers as close as possible to cut points for reference, then cut out most everything in between leaving about a second of extra on each end. Double-click between the markers to create a loop, set looping playback mode, and let it play repeatedly. Obviously there will be a nasty glitch at the point where i've already removed material, but when the cursor loops back to the first marker it should be close to a matched beat. I then tweak the in and out points of the loop until it sounds right. Now i can make a fine adjustment for zero crossings and do a final delete to get rid of the rest of the unwanted material. If you want to do this in ACID you'd have to first beat-map the track as exactly as possible and hope the tempo is completely constant throughout the entire song. Since you can only cut on the beat grid in ACID, the music beats have to line up with the grid or it won't work. It's also not possible to align to zero crossings either. So, all that considered i find this easier to do in Sound Forge. Even Vegas would be easier than ACID, if you disable quantize to frames. Vegas has one other advantage going for it. After finalizing the cut, just in case the sound is different before and after it, i can drag the edges across each other to make a crossfade to smooth out the transition. When doing this it isn't even necessary to cut on zero crossings.

Subject:Editing files using Beat Matching Technique

Posted by: cyberbeat

Date:2/5/2016 1:34:13 PM

Mostly I edit dance/club and hip-hop where if I remove a portion of a song, the beats need to absolutely 100% still line up exactly after making a cut.

So With that in mind, below is my method of doing this, but I'm looking for other and/or better ways to do these kinds of edits.

First I set the beginning and end of the portion I want to remove and then adjust the selection by looking at the beats and making sure to use zero crossings. I'll listen to it a few times in loop mode 'til it sounds good and finally cut the selection to the clipboard

Just to be sure I got the beats perfect I'll bring up the Mix dialog and play it to see if what I cut mixes along perfectly in synch with the existing audio.

If not, I press escape to close the Mix dialog, hit Ctrl+z for undo adjust the selection and repeat the process.

When I finally get it right the results are spot on! My question is though, there's got to be an easier and faster way to do this. Especially when trying to Mix-Paste. As I said the only reason I do this Mix part is to be sure that the portion I cut is so I can tell the beats are still lined up even after the cut is made.

how do others do this type of beat-critical type of editing?

Can't wait to read your responses and sory for such a long post!

Thanks.==Steve

Message last edited on2/5/2016 6:19:17 PM bycyberbeat.

Subject:RE: Editing files using Beat Matching Technique

Reply by: ChristoC

Date:2/5/2016 8:37:22 PM

SoundForge is rather cumbersome for what you are doing; I suggest looking at Sony ACID = http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/musicstudio which is built to do what you are wanting to do, and editing can be achieved on separate tracks - download the Demo first.

Subject:RE: Editing files using Beat Matching Technique

Reply by: Chienworks

Date:2/5/2016 9:03:19 PM

I do this in Sound Forge often. What i start with is placing markers as close as possible to cut points for reference, then cut out most everything in between leaving about a second of extra on each end. Double-click between the markers to create a loop, set looping playback mode, and let it play repeatedly. Obviously there will be a nasty glitch at the point where i've already removed material, but when the cursor loops back to the first marker it should be close to a matched beat. I then tweak the in and out points of the loop until it sounds right. Now i can make a fine adjustment for zero crossings and do a final delete to get rid of the rest of the unwanted material.

If you want to do this in ACID you'd have to first beat-map the track as exactly as possible and hope the tempo is completely constant throughout the entire song. Since you can only cut on the beat grid in ACID, the music beats have to line up with the grid or it won't work. It's also not possible to align to zero crossings either. So, all that considered i find this easier to do in Sound Forge. Even Vegas would be easier than ACID, if you disable quantize to frames.

Vegas has one other advantage going for it. After finalizing the cut, just in case the sound is different before and after it, i can drag the edges across each other to make a crossfade to smooth out the transition. When doing this it isn't even necessary to cut on zero crossings.