Subject:Deleting DXi plugs

Posted by: Raidan

Date:2/27/2002 1:58:44 PM

How do delete DXi fx plugs from FX list that comes up after pressing one of the FX tabs? I use a VST-DXi Wrapper and and I only want to list the Plugs that I actually have. Is there a way of clearing those old FX plugs out of the list? I've already deleted the FX that I didn't like, but the names of those FX are still listed and taking up room.

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:2/27/2002 2:55:33 PM

What's a VST-DXi Wrapper? Does it let you use DXi with Acid???

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Raidan

Date:2/27/2002 4:42:19 PM

YES. You can find Several of them at Hitsquad.com

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: rjt

Date:2/27/2002 8:44:27 PM

There are several, this one is pretty good:

http://www.analogx.com/contents/download/audio/dxman.htm

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:2/27/2002 10:46:06 PM

Thanks, definitely checking it out!

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:2/27/2002 10:59:45 PM

That's just some program for DELETING plug-ins. I want to plug them in. How do you find a DXi plug-in app at Hitsquad that will work with Acid? On the site there's a blizzard of apps with crazy names, none of them clearly for that intended purpose. Got a specific app name?

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:2/27/2002 11:34:22 PM

Okay, the best I can figure from the download-site jargon is that these "wrapper" things can convert VST PI's to DirectX which then can be used inside Acid--can't find anything that will directly let a DXi instrument be used in Acid, or even converted to a DirectX format. As usual, these techie-dominated download sites are not very user-friendly and assume you know what they're talking about in lingo-shorthand. Hopefully somebody here will take the time to explain all this mumbo-jumbo in very simple, direct layman's terms. For instance, what the f is a "wrapper"?

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:2/28/2002 1:18:13 AM

BTW, I'm assuming that DXi plug-ins do not work directly with DirectX-compatible apps like Acid. I realize how insane that sounds as DXi is simply "DirectX instruments" but such is the magic in the Land of Gates that the plausible becomes IM-plausible. The DirectX standard and the recent DXi standard seem to require some extra junk to talk to each other. For instance, there wasn't a single converter on the download site allowing DXi to work with DirectX, just VST to DirectX. Man, this is really NUTS! Why the f doesn't SF just release a version with both VST and DXi compatibility??? The code necessary for this is TRIVIAL!

Anyway, clearly this is an area WAAAY undercovered on this site and we need some genius to come in here and clarify all of this and show the way to existing specific solutions. I'm going to try one of these "wrapper"/converters tonight...but surprise, I'm not very optimistic it'll work.

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:2/28/2002 2:16:22 AM

Well, this is classic--you go to all the trouble of downloading this wrapper thing, then it tells you: "When you select VST DX Wrapper Lite in your host application (If you do not know how to do that, refer to your host application User’s Guide),"--of course, the Moronic Floundry manual does NOT tell you how to do this! In fact, in the FX plug-in window, it restricts you to only the audio FX file embedded in the app and does not allow any browsing to an external plug-in. Very cute. So it's impossible to access the "wrapper" in the first place. Of course, SF couldn't make it easy now, could they? Another huge waste of time all because SF won't give us open standards.

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Chienworks

Date:2/28/2002 11:27:33 AM

In simple layman's terms (i'm referring to simple terms used by laymen, not terms used by simple laymen) a wrapper is something that lets an object look like something else. The wrappers referred to in this case are bits of software that make a VST plugin look and behave like a DirectX plugin.

Getting a bit more techie, the wrapper translates what ACID sends to the plugin to VST, and translates what the plugin sends back to ACID to DirectX.

Make sense?

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: vanblah

Date:2/28/2002 2:27:47 PM

First of all I just have to ask why would Sonic Foundry give instructions for using a 3rd party plug-in? Secondly, I have used Spin Audio's VSTWrapper Pro for a while, although a lot of companies are selling their plug-ins in both formats now.

Here's how I have used it:

1. Install VSTWrapper
2. Install the VST plug-in you are trying to use
3. Launch the VSTWrapper Wizard from your start menu
4. Browse to the plug-in you're "wrapping" and follow the instructions from there.

The VST plugin should now show up in your FX dialog box in ACID and/or Vegas or under the DirectX menu in Sound Forge.

Repeat 3 and 4 for as many VST plug-ins that you download.

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:2/28/2002 5:23:22 PM

Thanks guys! Well, the tricky step was when you try to launch Wrapper, it demands to know what program you're going to use to launch it. Huh? That's not in the Read Me at all. Anyway, after banging away on it for a while, it looks like I got it to come up and sort of bring VSampler into Acid world--haven't had time to explore as yet but I will soon. Potentially exciting!

Oh yeah, anybody know why you can't just launch DXi's inside DirectX as plug-in to Acid? I mean, maybe you can but I've never seen anything anywhere suggesting it. This Wrapper thing works just with VST conversion straight to DirectX, which is okay, but it would be cool if all the DXi-world stuff loaded right into Acid via DirectX.

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:2/28/2002 9:49:55 PM

Ok, the sampler's up in the plug-in mode, but it gets no midi, makes no sound, is dead to the world, and there's no documentation to help with settings in this weird mode. Anybody have any bright ideas how to make this thing actually work? I guess you need a midi track to drive it and an audio track to play it, but god knows what settings or setup is necessary to achieve that.

Subject:VST-DX adapters, DX vs. DXi, and Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: SonicJG

Date:3/1/2002 2:49:45 PM

To save you some trouble Maruuk--it looks like you're using the SpinAudio VST-DX Adapter Lite, while vanblah was explaining how to use the VST-DX Adapter Pro. They work entirely differently. The Lite version looks like any DirectX plug-in to ACID, and basically translates the audio "signal" from DX specs to VST specs and back, acting as a real-time go-between. The Pro version is actually a stand-alone app that can be called from the Start Menu's Program group, and actually turns VST plug-ins into DirectX plug-ins, for all intents and purposes--you'll then see them listed in ACID's plug-in chooser with their own entry, rather than needing to be called from inside of a wrapper. You may also want to consider the VST-DX adapter at www.fxpansion.com, which works differently from the ones described above.

Second, there's actually a pretty big difference between DX and DXi, just as there's a difference between VST and VSTi. Don't let that one little "i" fool you. The "i" does stand for "instrument", which means that it does have a significantly different interface than a DX plug-in does. In other words, if you call up a VSTi plug-in in the VST-DX adapter, you'll have nothing but frustration--a DX plug-in basically requests that the host app send it an audio stream to process, and then returns an audio stream to the app. WRT DXi or VSTi plug-ins, in addition to the audio signal, there are a variety of other data interleaved into the stream that gets passed from app to plug-in. ACID 3.0 is not designed to handle the "i" stuff, as DXi is an adaptation of the DirectX standard done by Cakewalk, and VSTi was created for Cubase. As far as saying that the coding to support it would be "trivial", I can't really attest to that, but neither can you, unless you've already written and tested it. It's been a popular feature request though, so people should know that it's not falling on deaf ears...

As far as the original question, and the app at http://www.analogx.com/contents/download/audio/dxman.htm, that may be useful for removing DXi plug-ins from the host app's(ACID, etc) plug-in list, but I don't know if it'll work to remove plug-ins from the adapter's list, as the adapter is usually seeing VST or VSTi plug-ins. The DXman is a nice app, in any case, for getting under the hood and seeing some info about your plug-ins, beyond the standard interface they show in the app.

Best of luck,
Joel

Subject:RE: Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: pwppch

Date:3/1/2002 3:05:41 PM

>>The code necessary for this is TRIVIAL

Really Maruuk? Just HOW would you know this? Have you written an app that supports DX, VST, DXi, and VSTi? I'd like to see it if it is so trivial....

FYI: DXi and DX are totally different. They may fall under the same DirectX group of things, but they are VERY different.

Also, don't blame MS for DXi. DXi is Cawewalks' doing.

Peter

Subject:RE: VST-DX adapters, DX vs. DXi, and Deleting DXi plugs

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:3/1/2002 10:19:43 PM

Thanks, Sonic! Now we're getting somewhere. Especially good to hear SF is listening to the hordes of frustrated users with softsynths and samplers piling up which are useless in the Acid world. I'm more convinced than ever that 4.0 will be a godsend.