Subject:Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Posted by: Mr. Dreamstream

Date:11/27/2014 12:30:27 PM

I had this problem in version 9 and it's still happening with version 10.

When I apply the dynamics effect to limit to 6db, there are always a few individual wave peaks that do not get changed. I have been dealing with it by zooming in on each individual peak and re-applying the effect, and for some reason it works that way.

I have played with the adjustments and nothing seems to work.

Does anyone have the same problem? PC System 7 64-bit

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: musicvid10

Date:11/28/2014 8:02:53 AM

You are using a simple bandpass effect, when you need an intelligent limiter.
Use Wave Hammer instead.

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: rraud

Date:11/28/2014 9:14:41 AM

If you're referring to the 'Graphics Dynamics' effect, it could be 'overshoot' which is common, especially with analog comp/limiters. As MV stated Wave Hammer is a better choice, it's second stage Maximizer (brick wall peak limiter) will not allow any peaks beyond the output volume setting. Beware... excessive limiting will cause audible distortion.
The Graphics Dynamics effect has other valuable uses though, for instance as a compressor/expander with non-linear curves.. highly adjustable, probably not so good for folks w/o comp/limiter skills though.

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: Mr. Dreamstream

Date:11/28/2014 6:34:09 PM

Thanks for the responses but...

I am using Sound Forge version 10 (not the Pro version).
Go to the effects menu -> Dynamics

So I don't know what you mean by "Graphics Dynamics".
And I would like to understand why this program/effect isn't working as it is intended before buying more software.

Basically after I have done my EQ and dynamics to get the sound I want, I have a few straggly individual wave peaks that are slightly higher (like between 0 - 1.2db) that I want to get rid of before I do my final Normalize.

So if anyone can help me understand why that effect works on 95% of the peaks but misses 5%, or knows an alternative way to get the same result with THIS program, please let me know

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: Geoff_Wood

Date:11/28/2014 6:52:57 PM

It is probably working as intended. That just doesn't happened to be in line with your expectation or need in this instance. If you want more control (say adjustable 'Atttack' , which is your problem area i think), you may need to use a different Dynamics plugin.

geoff

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: rraud

Date:11/29/2014 8:45:55 AM

Not familiar with AS but, if the Dynamics effect is anything like the Pro version's Express FX Dynamic, I wouldn't use it.. There are many free VST limiters available that sound good if on a tight budget. Search for limiter/ maximizer plug-ins in sites like 'VST Warehouse', 'KVR', ect.

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: musicvid10

Date:11/29/2014 4:53:46 PM

You may be wanting something that catches intersample peaks; since these simple filters don't necessarily oversample or have true peak metering, a third party plugin may be what you want.

Why don't you show us a screenshot of a waveform that shows the problem.

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: Mr. Dreamstream

Date:11/30/2014 7:57:16 PM

I have a hard time believing they intended this effect to work 95% of the time and fail completely on 5% of the wave peaks that are above the limit. That would be like adjusting levels in Photoshop and having it randomly miss spots.

One of the Dynamics presets is "limit levels to -6db", so clearly SF is intended to be able to accomplish this task. I have played with all the adjustments and aside from selecting an individual wave peak, nothing affects the peaks the effect missed.

Having these missed peaks is a problem because the Normalize Process DOES recognize them and therefore fails to Normalize the file correctly.

I appreciate all the responses but I'm kind of mystified that on a forum for a specific program no one cares that it doesn't work correctly.

Now I'm wondering what is it people use SF for if not these basic functions?

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: Mr. Dreamstream

Date:11/30/2014 8:14:11 PM

This is more of an extreme limit than I usually do, but it shows the problem I am having.

http://mrdreamstream.tumblr.com/image/104035486147

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: Mr. Dreamstream

Date:12/2/2014 1:43:05 AM

I understood what musicvid was saying about intersample peaks, but I couldn't understand how the program could display the peaks on my screen if it was missing them in the sampling process.

But out of curiosity, I figured if I started the filter in a different place, the sample spots would hit the waveform in different places, and the odds would be against the same peaks escaping the limit again.

So I tried the limit effect a little less than the desired result, then moved the starting point of the highlighted area a little bit, repeated the effect and BOOM, all the peaks are gone. Repeating the effect without moving the starting point does not get rid of the peaks.

Running an extra instance of the limit effect is not optimal but at least now I understand what's happening. Thanks for all the responses.

Subject:RE: Dynamics effect misses individual wave peaks

Reply by: musicvid10

Date:12/3/2014 8:36:35 PM

Honestly, I've not talked with anyone on this forum who is using Dynamics as a peak limiter. The traditional Normalize or Wave Hammer are my choices, but I confess I haven't closely examined the resulting waveforms for stray peaks, either.