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Posted by: Marc1
Date:3/26/2013 12:47:34 PM

Anything SONY can take a hike.I buy NOTHING from SONY just for the fact of how they abandoned their Acid pro followers.People took all the time,'money'and hard work to learn their system and they kept everyone hanging by purposely not letting their followers know their secretly divorcing them.Any one who defends or offers excuses for their $$$$$ actions might just be suffering from Stockholm syndrome.I dont buy their TVs ,speakers NADA!!!!!!Wake up.See Ya wouldn't want to by yaa SONY. Presonus.Studio one RULES!!!!! ;->

Message last edited on3/26/2013 10:40:42 PM byMarc1.
Reply by: Geoff_Wood
Date:3/26/2013 7:14:52 PM

Did you mean "Nada" ?



Reply by: [r]Evolution
Date:3/27/2013 6:43:44 AM

Although it does feel like a slow & painful death... I would hate to see Acid die.
It would be nice to see all the Acid features roll over into Vegas.

Reply by: 519tbarr
Date:3/27/2013 9:43:02 AM

I agree whole heartedly.
Sony either needs to sell Acid Pro and it's patents to another company that will develop the software or they should scrap Sound Forge and roll all of Acid Pro and Sound Forge features into a master DAW. Presonus Studio One has that end right by having both the DAW and Mastering aspect together in one program.
For as many DAW's as I've been using this year due to the fact that Acid Pro hasn't been updated in years and can only handle so much in the way of plugin effects I miss a few of things from Acid Pro in other DAW's.
ie: The paint brush, the time ruler (and the depth to which you can scroll in and be accurate!) I miss the properties function with the beat mapping section - being able to re-adjust your beat up to 64th's is still brilliant - especially when you get a loop that is truly out of sync.
Just a few of the things I miss that Acid Pro ruled on.

Reply by: AudioVizionz
Date:3/27/2013 11:53:28 AM

I am completely enamored with AP7e. I have a main Dell system with xp but just recently upgraded my Dell Precision 670 with Windows 7 Ultimate as a clone. i have all the power I need and able to compose/arrange anything I can imagine. so imo everyone that says they can't work with 7e is confusing indeed.
regarding incorporating SF and AP into Vegas, i agree that is an intriguing scenario and hope they explore that option. athough it's been difficult to understand I do see the logic behind postponing AP development in lieu of the other projects they had going with Vegas, SF etc. but it's way past time for them to continue AP development or to sell it.
Most iimportantly, keep creating!

Reply by: 519tbarr
Date:3/27/2013 3:33:49 PM

Its very simple.
For me... I can't personally have a max on ram that I use or a limitation on the amount of plugins I use in AP 7. Along with that fact that we are still stuck in 32 bit land. Ive had the evil black screen of death on the plugin window more than I care to admit in AP 7.
In a current track im mixing in Reaper we are running 120 plugins flawlessly. My groups recordings are slightly un-orthodox but we manage to produce pretty decent recordings in our home studios.
I would still love to see AP come back from the dead.

Message last edited on3/27/2013 3:35:05 PM by519tbarr.
Reply by: guitacid
Date:3/27/2013 7:20:20 PM

I notice in Sony's newsletter they say they'll be at the NAB show in April. Showing new products???

If anyone from the forum is going to the NAB show please ask Sony what the situation is with Acid Pro. Whilst I still get stuff done in AP7 I'm interested in knowing if it will get a refresh.


Reply by: b.complex
Date:3/30/2013 9:11:02 AM

I agree with 519. I love ACID, but it's a secondary app at this point, especially since Sony abandoned it. I always look forward to the Sony announcements at NAB and so forth though, because I am a professional Sony Vegas user, and they have continued to develop Vegas in a smart and logical way that has made it a true contender in the editing world (even if most editors don't know it). I am really, really disappointed that Sony decided to kill off ACID, but it makes no sense to me to "abandon" all Sony products when I am so heavily invested in VEGAS and various plugins. And yes, Studio One is great, that is what I switched to...and I've gotten a lot done since I stopped battling the limitations of ACID, especially using VSTi's.

Message last edited on3/30/2013 9:12:31 AM byb.complex.
Reply by: deusx
Date:4/11/2013 2:23:25 AM

>>>>In a current track im mixing in Reaper we are running 120 plugins flawlessly.<<<<

Number of plugins used by Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd and The Beatles in about 40 years of their combined careers:


Reply by: 519tbarr
Date:4/11/2013 8:48:22 AM

No questions asked... (0 plugins)
Dollar value of gear Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd and Beatles had....

Milions in each individual studio!!!

Gear coming out of each corner of the room. Neumann mics, original Marshall amps, AKG C12's, Universal Audio equipment... All sorts of professional gear and paid engineers. The day and age where money was liquid for bands in the studio and they had access to whatever was current at the time. And also...
Those bands had to know how to play their instruments professionally!

Today - most people have a little home studio. Most people sitting behind their little home studio are not trained professionals in the area of sound production.

But on the bright side of life - what a wonderful world to be able to record in - the digital realm. And be able to take the time and produce the music you want to produce and love to hear.

Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd and The Beatles are all legends. Jimmy Page was the master of recording music whom we owe a lot of gratitude to for his contributions and innovative mastery in the studio.


Message last edited on4/11/2013 8:48:42 AM by519tbarr.
Reply by: Vocalpoint
Date:4/11/2013 10:27:37 AM

In a current track im mixing in Reaper we are running 120 plugins flawlessly.


Deux brings up a very valid point - despite the giants of rock did have "studios" at their disposal - one very important distinction must be noted - in the early going - these guys had 8 or 10 or 16 tracks (at best) in which to work with and had ZERO plugins to use. If they needed an effect - it would have to be printed to tape and committed - FOREVER. There was no going back and changing your mind.

That these bands cranked out some of the greatest music ever recorded - on 8 or 10 or 16 tracks is a testament to their skill in not only playing - but songwriting and arranging.

Apologies - but if you actually "need" 120 plugins to make a song happen - you probably need to rethink how it is that you work. Also of note (and not revealed) is how many individual tracks you have in this "120 plugin" project you are working on in Reaper. Something tells me it's a lot...

Acid 7 can be restricting but just because you have unlimited tracks and gobs of plugins in your collection - doesn't mean you have to use them all on every track you create.

I have gone the other way over the years - no song of mine shall ever go beyond 24 tracks regardless of application, complexity or anything else. I would rather force my skills in getting a great song down with the least amount of tracks (and certainly the least amount of plugins) rather than laboring over 28 tracks of guitar solos trying to decide what's right.

My take - if Pink Floyd can do what they did - on 24 tracks - it's good enough for me.


Message last edited on4/11/2013 10:31:45 AM byVocalpoint.
Reply by: 519tbarr
Date:4/11/2013 12:29:08 PM

Point noted VP.

Part of my largeness of tracks - comes from old recordings that we started recording in AP years ago... with a certain lack of knowledge about how to track music back in the day and trying to make things sound thick and full. There was a lot of excess tracking - that we have slowly been weeding out.

I love and envy the old school guys who were able to do what they did on 2 inch tape and in some ways I wish music was a simple as that. For me music has become a whole lot more like "Mutt Lange" especially trying to clean these old tracks up... which were not recorded on a single dollar of budget. When I started this project... I had one crappy Marshall Valvestate, a 57 mic a crappy 4 channel alto board 2 ibanez guitars and a bass. Creating the music to a degree became like part - party - music in its structure and I literally started looking for takes and pieces that worked together to make things happen.

Fast forward to today and through members that know who they are ;) I ended up solving some of my multi-track insanity - courtesy of Studio One V2 and Reaper. The comping system in S1v2 is amazing and has cut down my bass tracks and guitar takes exponentially.

Maybe when I am recording the 2nd Red Light Masters record I will not feel like a small mad scientist doing what I am doing and I expect my track counts will be under a hundred.

At the end of the day, yes there's the old school way of doing things, and there is the new school way of doing things. And it really boils down to getting the recorded takes you want and finding the sounds you desire.

I love making music and recording great sounding music and am amazed at how we can do things compared to 1998 using adat tapes and some early versions of Pro Tools on MAC OS 9.(whatever)

Everyone in the world - keep making great music.
Software developers keep pushing the envelope and making great software and plugins that push the boundaries!

my music is available for listening at
a large majority of it was recorded in AP7.

Message last edited on4/11/2013 12:31:41 PM by519tbarr.
Reply by: Vocalpoint
Date:4/11/2013 1:16:58 PM

And it really boils down to getting the recorded takes you want and finding the sounds you desire.

True - but not at the expense of filling endless tracks with useless crap.

See - I started back in 85 with a 4 track Portastudio on cassette and I learned to accept "limitations" as being part of the plan. With a max of ten audio streams (full bounce on a 4 track cassette) - one must really be on the ball to get anything meaningful. It also taught me real early to "let go": of things.

But then - with the advent of tools like Acid, Nuendo etc - with unlimited tracks and tons of plugins - I fell into a trap of f-ing around with every composition to the point of exhaustion - and after a while - I finally admitted to myself that I could never actually finish anything due to the "tools" called me - saying - "you can fix this by adding 5 more tracks" :) It never works.

So - now - my standard S1 template has 24 tracks...I get to work and I either go til I have no more tracks or I get what I need before I fill em all up. I do not waste anything and do not do 50 takes on a solo.

To be honest - my stuff sounds light years better now than it ever had during those "wasted" years when I thought 60 or 70 tracks was cool. There is only so much audio spectrum and only so much room to properly mix tracks into a cohesive whole. The less tracks you have - the better it sounds - simple as that.

The "skill" in recording is not only good playing and good arranging but the ability to say "This thing is finished - enough is enough" and knowing when to let go.


Reply by: 519tbarr
Date:4/11/2013 1:33:26 PM


As Ron Burgundy would say - Agree to Disagree! ;) Haha!
I get what you are saying - but for me - it's all about the song.
There are enough musicians, enough songs, enough not thought out songs, I could go on, but I won't!

Make the music you want to make! Learn from it, enjoy it! Grow as a writer and a producer!

Everyone does something different! That's the beauty of music!

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