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Subject:ACID vs. Sonar ???
Posted by: u4ik
Date:11/13/2001 2:01:10 PM
I'm looking into getting Sonar, done some reading and it seems to do a pretty good job of "replacing" ACID and adding more features, one good one...MIDI. Any thoughts or opinions on Sonar? |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: SHTUNOT
Date:11/13/2001 2:57:46 PM
If you got the cash to spend then get it.I useCubase and wavelab for some stuff like midi in conjunction with SoFo stuff. I can't see what the big deal is on this product[sonar] because if you combine the features of both vegas audio+ acid+soundforge...you should be set. Unless of course you are in desparate need of midi capabilities. If that was the case then why did you buy acid in the first place? If you want amazing midi capabilities with rock solid timing then I would recommend the latest version of cubase[5.1].They "LTB" technology...linear time based...If you buy a product called the MIDEX 8,then all of the midi timing will be controlled by the outboard gear and you'll have an amazingly tight timing of all of your gear.www.steinberg.net www.cubase.net...look up midex8. Again I'll state that the newest version of vegas audio is just around the horizon and I can hardly wait to see how vegas audio "leap frogs" over these other apps and everyone on their site says the same thing about sonic foundry products.[they have already on the cubase site, about implementing acid type features!haha!]my 2 cents.later. |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: Maruuk
Date:11/14/2001 7:47:49 PM
SF censored out my last post but I'll try it again: Sonar destroys Acid. If you can afford it, go for it. Can't even tell what you can do over Acid. If you're broke, go with the little brother "Plasma"--many of the same features for way less ($39). Acid is great if you just want to dick around with loops like a little kid. Once you have to make music, there are a number of vastly superior products which are Acid-loop compatible. Don't even think about techno-nerdery like midi-sync and routers. Yikes! Stick with an integrated all-in-one app which lets you render all to one destination in the computer, all mixed through the same soft mixer. Good luck! |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: Rockitglider
Date:11/14/2001 8:26:14 PM
Hello, Sonar.......Toooo Complicated. You'll be reading the manual more than making music, If you want a program thats easy to use and fun to use then go with Acid 3.0 Pro, It's the Best!! See ya, Rockit |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: Maruuk
Date:11/14/2001 8:40:15 PM
Since you mention midi and the price of Sonar is not a barrier there is no reason to consider Acid. Acid has extremely limited midi features and virtually no audio record, no synths, no samplers, no standards support (ReWire/DXi/VST). It's a toy for kids to goof around with loops, especially since 3.0c is so buggy only a kid would tolerate the zaps and glitches in the audio. Sonar has FULL midi/sequencer support--piano-roll editing, etc. plus unlimited audio track record. It doesn't treat midi or audio as some bastard interloper to be tolerated but abused like Acid does. And try to fire up a synth or a sampler inside to render out to your master...ooops, it doesn't have any at all. I'll just plug-in my VST or DXi sampler or synth here...ooops, doesn't have ANY standards support. Bottom line, any integrated and complete Acid-compatible app is going to have a longer manual than Acid--probably because IT CAN DO WAY MORE. By a factor of about 50. |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: Rockitglider
Date:11/14/2001 9:00:01 PM
ACID RULES!!!!!!!! Way better than sonar sonar is way too expensive, half the crap in that program you won't even use. Rockit |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: Iacobus
Date:11/14/2001 11:51:13 PM
OK, everyone, before this turns into a flame war... :) (or has it already?) Look, each program has its strength and its weaknesses. It all depends on what you're looking for in a program. It's actually dumb to compare the two. Personally, I love ACID Pro 3. I always will love it. The most basic reason is because there's a program that finally lets me express the music I want to make. The weakest thing I can find in ACID is that it has no MIDI editing support. That's no big deal to me, as I don't use a lot of MIDI (if at all) anyway. Quite frankly, MIDI is great for interfacing instruments and equipment with software and all, but as a composition tool? Eh. I don't really need it, as I can record what I need separately in Sound Forge and bring it into ACID... Which brings me to another issue: ACID is not, nor will(should?) ever be a, "be-all, end-all" program. (I feel like a broken record when I say that.) ACID is the king of loop-based music production in my world. It is meant to compliment the other wonderful programs from Sonic Foundry (Sound Forge and Vegas Audio anyone?). I'll also say it again: I have no problems using ACID Pro 3. Sure, there's the niggling bug or two, but nothing life-stopping for me. I can also vouch for people having problems with Sonar. There's two sides to every story. I would bet all these problems stem from computer hardware/software configuration. I don't doubt Sonar is a great program. I'm really sure it is. (I used to wean myself on Cakewalk Express way back when.) However, the weakness with Sonar is, IMHO, its interface. When you take a look at the sample screenshot of Sonar that Cakewalk gives on their site, you can't help but feel overwhelmed. (Is that project they show even usable?) I almost get the feeling Cakewalk is trying to show all the bells and whistles at once to impress me... Which brings me back to ACID Pro. Although it looks simple on the surface, it's really quite powerful once you get past its almost-too-simple interface. (All of you advanced users of ACID Pro must know that.) I would hardly call it a toy. If such a name is to stem action to fix the bugs and to add more features in ACID Pro, that's not being constructive or helpful; it's being a little hurtful and destructive. So, again, it really comes down to this: Both are powerful. It just all depends what you're looking for in a program. Want an "all-in-one" type of program? Sonar (or even Cubase or Logic) just might be your bag. Don't want or need that much MIDI and just want to work exclusively in the audio realm? SF's products are a force to reckoned with. Just my 2 bits, Iacobus |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: SHTUNOT
Date:11/14/2001 11:57:15 PM
Just buy it dude. You can't go wrong with another application to work on. Like I said before I use both cubase/wavelab and vegas/soundforge/acid for my audio/video stuff. There are things that I love and hate with each of them...But with certain projects they all seem to have a hand in the finished product...the outcome is a great sounding tune.Later. |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: VU-1
Date:11/15/2001 12:16:42 AM
Oops! Looks like the dude working the tune on the Sonar screen shot has a little bit o' clippage goin' on. JL |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: Rockitglider
Date:11/15/2001 2:56:11 AM
Hello, I'm just tired of people coming to this forum and bashing Acid on it's own forum, Go to Cakewalk forum and do that. Acid doesn't deserve that, It's a great program. I use some cakewalk software too, (Guitar Tracks Pro), It's simple interface as well. But to me Sonar is too complicated...But I'm not going to go to Cakewalk forum and bash Sonar on their forums, I'd get torn appart. See ya Rockit BTW: You can give an opinion without bashing a product. |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: nvp1200
Date:11/15/2001 10:28:33 AM
Try both softwares!!! Before purchasing anything use the demos. I build all my beats on ACID which i find so much easier to use then put it in SONAR. I use both...ACID is the best software for what is does...LOOPS! Sonar does everything else with midi/soundfonts/external modules/etc...ofcourse you have to do alot of reading with Sonar's manual...its a $500 application with so many features that you would want to use to its full potential. ACID 3.0 comes with Sound Forge for Editing and VEGAS for Multitracking...what more can you ask for if your just starting off? Peace! |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: Styrerra
Date:11/15/2001 7:09:49 PM
I would have to agree with the pops and clicks being attributed to the hardware. Jot down all your hardware (brought with or without computer) and look for the upgrades (and forums if possible) and make the necessary (nessessary only if you have pops and clicks) tweaks to fix your problem. You should also know the tweaks and tips for your OS type. And don't be afraid to ask others if your completely new (although this isn't a good forum for that) I have yet to experiance pops and clicks after I made all my tweaks and I only have a 500mhz with 9ms latency. Far cry from 1.7 or up who have WAy more problems than I have. |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: hecatenv
Date:11/16/2001 8:27:03 AM
So, i'm not sure how late I am in this post...And i'm not sure if I am reinstating anything that someone else may have posted cause, frankly, all the posts I read(about the first 10) were ignorant opinions on two sides. Sonar kicks ass....Acid Pro 3.0 kicks ass. The loopoing in Ssonar really sucks. The loop explorer doesn't let you preview the loop before you load it and you can't edit the loops(Like you would do by using the eraser tool, Split at Cursor, etc. tools in Acid) When I first got into computer recording, I picked up a copy of Acid. I had almost no money, so I couldn'y buy any hardware synths or anything, and I thought midi referred to general midi....So, like Rockit, or whoever it was, thought all the features on cakewalk were useless. Well, further down the road, I found that using loops and shit like that left my music to sound bland, or unexciting. I got made some money, and I bought an MS2000, an Alesis QSR, and SBLive Platinum 5.1, some other stuff and a copy of Cakewalk Pro Audio 9...That's when I realized that Cakewalk was the SHIT. It's power is awesome enough, and what blows my mind is how easy the interface is. When i record, I like to loop my guitar riffs, and sometimes use drum loops(though I hate monotinousness). Ssome may disagree, but I think Acid 3.0 is the shit for recording my guitars...Assignable effects, busses, the chopper, and all those tools to make perfect guitar loops from my recordings...Plus the perfect integration with Soundforge 5. So, I picked up a copy of Sonar(from a friend)...I thought it was going to be my dream come true...In terms of midi, and DXi's....It is...But the looping in Sonar is so liumited...You can barely do anything with them...And there's nothing I hate more than having a plain loop in my music. So....WWhat do you do? If all you do is loop, and that's it(no chopping up loops or anything) and you want good midi capabilities...Then Ssonar is MOST DEFINATELY the choice for you. If you like the looping capabilities of Acid, and the midi capabilities of Cakewalk....Then get Cakewalk AND Acid....And SYNC them together! Which is actually what brought me to this forum...Syncronising is CONFUSING...But highly possible...SSo, i'm here to get a few answers, and then i'm off to write some badass music. I'm learning Cubase 5 right now...You wanna try a confusing program? Then try Cubase VST 5.0...Jesus. I have learned how to use VST instruments and prgram them in VST...But that's about it for now...But, hey...I've ony had the prog for a few hours. |
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Subject:Hecatenv, Your guitar loops
Reply by: Rockitglider
Date:11/16/2001 9:56:26 AM
Hey hecatenv, How do you make your guitar loops in Acid to loop perfectly? I've been trying to get a good answer on this for a while, Thanks for any help. See ya, Rockit |
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Subject:RE: Hecatenv, Your guitar loops
Reply by: hecatenv
Date:11/16/2001 5:53:39 PM
Pretty simple: This works perfectly EVERY time. I record the guitar part 4 times in a row. After recording(if you have Acid Pro 3.0) double click on the track I just recorded which brings up track properties. Under track properties you see a waveform which lets you highlight segments of the wav file. I highlight the 3rd out of the 4 times I played the guitar over....I right click on the highlighted area and open it up in Soundforge 5.0, I copy that and paste it into a new file and save it as another file. Of course, you can just use the chopper, and do the same thing with that...But I like to have a folder where I can gather all the master tracks ready for remix. This looping trick works perfectly...It doesn't sound one bit like it is looped. And that, my friend, is the power of Acid Pro. I just wish It had full midi capabilities. It just limits my creativity when I can't do everything in one prog. Anyways, if you have trouble unnderstanding what I explained, just drop me an email. |
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Subject:RE: Hecatenv, Your guitar loops
Reply by: Rockitglider
Date:11/16/2001 9:38:31 PM
Hello again, Now your talking about looping not oneshots right? Some people record a one shot and call it a loop, but I want to make actual loops for sure, not oneshots. I think the trouble I might be having is maybe my progressions are not exactly in perfect time, like the third beat of one measure not exactly on the mark. They will loop good with some beats but not all, like factory loops on loop disks do. Thanks again, Rockit |
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Subject:RE: Hecatenv, Your guitar loops
Reply by: Iacobus
Date:11/17/2001 5:41:26 PM
Hey Rockit, did you get my email reply not so long ago? I remember you emailing some of your own (nice) guitar samples and emailed you back using your samples along with mine. I didn't really find anything wrong with your loops. They seemed spot on to me. Iacobus |
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Subject:RE: Hecatenv, Your guitar loops
Reply by: Rockitglider
Date:11/17/2001 6:45:41 PM
Hey Iacobus, Yeah I got it, amd I meant to send you some bad ones, but havent had the time yet. But I will. I'm workin' toooo hard. Rockit |
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Subject:RE: Hecatenv, Your guitar loops
Reply by: Iacobus
Date:11/17/2001 6:50:55 PM
Tell me about it. :) Take your time. Iacobus |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: westside
Date:11/18/2001 3:40:44 AM
Acid is a great program, It works loops well... But Sonar does much more. I don't feel that it's that much more complicated. You can do many of the same functions with loops, but Sonar will allow you to integrate midi as well.. I work in a studio with a Mac head, we both used Acid and were amazed. Now with Sonar, he can't believe what I can do with it. I use Acid less and less. Way too limiting. The worst part of all is the midi sync/mtc. If that worked properly I would use acid much more. I just started getting into Reason and it syncs up with Sonar with 0 problems... I have used it for 2 weeks and can't believe what it can do. As for Acid, there is not much difference between 2.0 and 3.0, and that has gotten many of us here pissed. We expected more from SF. I love ALL of their products and think they do a bang up job, but feel they need to do more with ACID. Try them both and see what fits right. But at the very least go buy their loop disks, they are for the most part fantastic! And work well in both programs |
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Subject:RE: ACID vs. Sonar ???
Reply by: Maruuk
Date:11/18/2001 5:09:15 PM
westside--How are you syncing Reason to Sonar? Since Sonar isn't ReWire-compatible, do you have to midi-sync 'em and then deal with two completely separate audio outputs which can't render together? |