Subject:BPM varies

Posted by: Styrerra

Date:10/26/2001 10:41:03 PM

On wav files I create (same tempo) the bpm vary from t0o fast to too slow. why?

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: Iacobus

Date:10/26/2001 10:43:39 PM

Which program are you using to create your loops? Sound Forge? Recording straight into ACID?

Iacobus

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: Styrerra

Date:10/27/2001 12:32:04 PM

Mainly my own loops I create into short Wavs. And it does happen in Sound Forge as well I think.

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: Iacobus

Date:10/27/2001 12:40:19 PM

See my reply at this post. (NOTE: Opens a new browser window.) It details how to construct and ACIDize a loop in Sound Forge for use with ACID.

HTH,
Iacobus

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: PatrickL

Date:10/27/2001 12:50:31 PM

Thanks, but most of these loops do not come from Sound Forge (1 did but for the most part the loops are made and non-edited from SF). I will try that if it happens again in SF, thanks!

But what about loops from line in? Lets say I created 2 loops with 129 bpm. One will be really slow and the other will be really fast. The only difference I can see is the length of time. The loops may be 4 seconds and 8 seconds (for example).

Also why Cntrl-E? shouldn't it be Cntrl-V?

*just dropped the 'styrerra name moniker'

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: Iacobus

Date:10/27/2001 4:23:37 PM

You'd use CTRL+E to paste the selection into a new window within Sound Forge. This is so your original file doesn't get destroyed in the process of editing.

It doesn't matter whether or not the samples were made to be looped or not. One of Sound Forge's many purposes is to help you create a custom loop from many other sources.

You would still use the technique I described for those two examples. If you record both at the same tempo but one sounds slow while the other sounds fast, you're actually telling me that (in music theory) one sample is, for example, using quarter notes while the other sample is using 8th notes, respectively.

To put it in perspective, in a 4/4 time signature, there are 4 beats in a measure, and a quarter note gets one beat. In this time signature, since a quarter note gets one beat, that means an 8th note gets half a beat. (8th notes are next in line after quarter notes in the note value hierarchy.)

You'd obviously need two 8th notes to equal one quarter note in the duration of one beat. Therefore, the rhythm of a voice using just 8th notes would sound faster than a voice using just quarter notes in the very same tempo.

What you'll have to determine on your own is where exactly the downbeats are in your samples, so that you can eventually match them up using a specified tempo.

If you're having trouble, send two samples along to me, and I'll send modifications back to you so you can listen to how Sound Forge and ACID work beautifully together in making loops. My email is here.

HTH,
Iacobus

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: Darklight20

Date:10/27/2001 5:28:32 PM

Why should BPMs varying matter anyway i thought the whole point of acid was to match BPMs for you. You can make the loop whaver lenght of beats and tempo you want in the project just by going to its personal properties area and changing it. Also with 3.0 the pitch does change. Am I the one missing something here?

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: PatrickL

Date:10/27/2001 5:51:53 PM

No No No. This is all the same time signature. I didn't say the time signature changed.

IE: I record a part from my keyboard. stop recording. start again without changing anything to the keyboard and record again. The first recording may sound slow, second to fast.

The BPM varies. It could be the same patch but ACID changes the tempo without me doing anything.

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: Iacobus

Date:10/27/2001 8:27:17 PM

I believe PatrickL wants to make a homemade loop, not a "canned" loop from one of the many excellent loop libraries SF has to offer.

There's a twofold challenge to making a homemade loop. The sample in question should have a definite rhythm to it so that the downbeats can be found. On top of that, the sample in question should be ACIDized so it'll sound good in just about any tempo or key. However, as Sonic Foundry would tell you, loops sound especially great in their original tempo and key that they were composed in. It's just a fact. Loops also tend to sound better when the tempo is faster than the loop's original tempo than slower.

It'd be much easier if you didn't have to actually access the properties of the track in question (unless you're going for a particular sound or feel, otherwise go for it) just to correct mistakes. Better to have it correct right from the start.

Iacobus

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: Iacobus

Date:10/27/2001 8:52:30 PM

OK, there's a little confusion going on here, which I'll try to clear up.

I know you didn't say the time signature changed. From what I could gather, the tempo stays the same but the rhythm of your takes seems off. This could be due to the way they're being recorded. Read on.

You could record your samples straight into ACID. However, note that you should be aware of a couple of things. If the take you're recording is at a desired, final tempo for the whole project, you'll probably want to clear the "Make new track follow project tempo" option and treat the whole take as a One-Shot.

Otherwise, the track will be treated as a Beatmapped track. ACID will use its time stretching features to make the take follow the tempo of the rest of the project, which may leave undesirable results.

Are you using Sound Forge's ACID loop creation tools to ensure that the samples don't go out of whack in ACID?

Can you give a more detailed, step-by-step method of how you're recording? Include the software you're using. Ideally, you should record your samples into Sound Forge, ACIDize them using SF's loop tools and then bring them into ACID.

HTH,
Iacobus

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: PatrickL

Date:10/27/2001 9:22:01 PM

Actually I will try what you said in the first few paragraphs. I don't usually bring them into SF prolly cos I was used to the free version of ACID without SF for awhile.

Subject:RE: BPM varies

Reply by: Darklight20

Date:10/28/2001 1:55:37 AM

Well all my loops are home made and i've never used the edit tempo feature. I usually just extract the song or record the movie clip or keyboard part i'm using in sound forge and edit it so it sounds like it loops correctly. Then i take it and loop it in acid with whatever tempo i think sounds right. Isn't impossible for it to be off in time since the loop is set to up to start and restart in a certain time signature and tempo with the rest of the project?