OT When will Canon lift the DSLR 12 min max??

Mindmatter wrote on 4/21/2011, 7:00 AM

Hi all,

at first I thought it would not bother me too much, until I tried to record a concert of mine...I googled around a bit and found the 12min / 4GB limit to be purely an arbitrary limit installed mainly for VAT reasons, because the video DSLRs would then have to be taxed like a video camcorder with different taxes on it. NOT what people are lead to believe, namely a heat problem.
I had a shimmer of hope when I read in a review that the T2i accepted XDSC 64 Gb cards with exFAT formatting, theoretically busting the 4Gb limit. Got one today, and...I was wrong. The cam just says " video was stopped automatically " after 12 minutes!

It is really a PITA of the consumer and I hope some firmware will take care of this as more and more people seem to be complaining about it.
Anyone happens to know if there's any news about this?
Thanks!

Comments

farss wrote on 4/21/2011, 7:16 AM

Sorry but I think your assumptions are wrong. The 4GB limit is not purely arbitary at all. To close a file and open another to continue recording requires quite a lot of work from the camera. Clearly the manufactuers of still cameras see little point in the extra cost and power consumption implementing this would add to the camera.

As for VAT thing that sounds like an urban myth to me. I can think of no reason why video cameras and still cameras would attract a different tax rate at all. Both are luxury items, both are manufactured in the EU. There's some purely video cameras that could only record for 11 minutes due to the capacity of the cards and I don't recall them suddenly costing more when larger P2 cards came along.

Bob.

PeterDuke wrote on 4/21/2011, 7:17 AM

Are you sure that it is not due to the 4GB limit of FAT file systems used on memory cards? Even so, they could create multiple files that you could glue together afterwards, like AVCHD video cams do.

Edit
Sorry Bob, you beat me to it.

dlion wrote on 4/21/2011, 7:33 AM

Magic Lantern http://magiclantern.wikia.com/wiki/550D is a firmware hack for the T2i, 5D and 60D that, among many other things, has a feature called Movie Restart:

"While this setting is on, movie recording will restart automatically, unless stopped
by you. There will be a few seconds skipped during restarting."

This may be helpful to you. Even with this, if you're doing an event that requires continuous shooting, DSLRs are not the way to go.

drewU2 wrote on 4/21/2011, 7:52 AM

I use multiple DSLR's to record live events (2 Canon t2i's, 1 Canon 60d and 1 Panasonic GH1). Here's what I do:

1) Use the $600 Canon Vixia HFS10...you can buy them refurbished at Canon's direct store here...http://shop.usa.canon.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10051_10051_249401_-1
2) Then have the HFS10 as your wide angle shot. It takes in a good amount of light indoors and records admirably at 1080 24p in AVCHD. With the 32gb of internal memory it will record at its highest bit rate for a little over 4 hours.
3) Then set up a couple of DSLR's and have someone check on them every 10 minutes or so to restart the recording. Even if you miss a minute or two from the DSLR's stopping, you can use the wide angle from the HFS10 and then go back to the DSLR of your choice.

I realize this isn't the cheapest option, but it does help "overcome" DSLR limitations. What's more, you could even get a cheaper consumer camcorder as your wide angle. I just recommend the Canon Vixia HFS10 or HFS100 because I have used them literally for hundreds of hours of filming and the image quality is near (not at, but fairly close) that of a Panasonic HMC150 (I used to own this until I went to all DSLR's).

Mindmatter wrote on 4/21/2011, 8:46 AM

Thanks everyone for the input.
Peter says: Are you sure that it is not due to the 4GB limit of FAT file systems used on memory cards? Even so, they could create multiple files that you could glue together afterwards, like AVCHD video cams do.

Peter, with my XDSC card formatted in exFAT, that 4 gig limit is no longer valid. I read on several foriûms that the stopping process is purely arbitrary, as you can just push the record button straight again and it restarts recording.
AFAI understand it ( not claiming to understand it all but still...) there is no rational reason the Canon cannot go on recording. It records SD for 30 minutes.

thanks dlion, I read about it yesterday, It's better than nothing, but for a concert recording it would still make a considerable gap, thus unusable.

CClub wrote on 4/21/2011, 9:47 AM

I had also bought the T2i thinking that the 12 minute limit wouldn't be that big of a deal, as I only record concerts occasionally. I found it incredibly limiting with ALL forms of recording. You can't leave it unattended on a tripod during any event recording, but it's likely not your primary camera, so where do you put it? Even during corporate projects and a local film project I'm working on, it disrupts the entire recording when you have to let everyone know that the take you're working on has to stop mid-stream while I reset the camera. I didn't think that would affect everything that much, but since I'm not dealing with Hollywood actors, I found that it really detracted and fouled up several great takes.

My solution: I took the hit of a couple hundred dollars and sold it as quickly as I could on eBay and bought the Panasonic GH2. Much better for my workflow, and no time limits. If I go over 4 GB's, it starts right back recording. Then, in post, you can re-connect those files without missing a beat (check on this forum to accomplish this via Device Explorer).

richard-amirault wrote on 4/21/2011, 10:29 AM

The 4 gig limit is a fact of life with DSLR recording. It matters little for some folks. It matters a lot for others. For some it matters so much they they purchase something else (like myself)

AND ... it's not just Canon that has that limit.

Yoyodyne wrote on 4/21/2011, 10:48 AM

That's what I've been doing as well drewU2 and it has worked great.

As for the 12 minute limit - the Panasonic GH2 does not have this limit.

I also thought it was a 4gig file size limit thing but Philip Bloom said it actually was an international tax thing at one of his seminars. It sounds ridiculous but there ya' go. I can't imagine Canon wont have this solved in the next generation of their DSLRs but I'm pretty sure there will never be an official fix for the current crop of cams.

MarkHolmes wrote on 4/21/2011, 11:55 AM

I'll echo that there is no file or time limit on the GH2. It's one of the main reasons I sold my 7D and bought 2 GH2s.

I use them for recording live theater - one camera set to auto-iris and unattended, the other tended by me, recording non-stop for 60-90 minutes at a time. The GH2s sold in Europe, however, DO have a 29 minute limit. So there does seem to be some kind of VAT or regulation that causes this.

I actually think a big part of the reason Canon has a limit is their overheating issues. Even within that 12-minute time frame they often overheat and shut down. I've never experienced nor heard of any overheating of GH2s.

If you're in the US, though, sell your Canons and buy a couple GH2s. Worked for me.

MarkHolmes wrote on 4/21/2011, 11:59 AM

Mindmatter - here's a nice clip of a concert recording on the GH2 - gives you a good idea what can be done with these little cams:

http://vimeo.com/groups/gh2/videos/19915047

rmack350 wrote on 4/21/2011, 1:09 PM

Hey Mark,

I have a GH1. Off the top of your head, what's better about the GH2?

Rob Mack

Chienworks wrote on 4/21/2011, 2:01 PM

"Peter, with my XDSC card formatted in exFAT, that 4 gig limit is no longer valid. I read on several foriûms that the stopping process is purely arbitrary, as you can just push the record button straight again and it restarts recording."

That's probably meaningless, as when you press the button to start recording again it will be writing to a new file.

Mindmatter wrote on 4/21/2011, 11:53 PM

Thanks again everyone, interesting thoughts and comments.
Marc, thanks I'll have a look at the Panasonic, but I admit that image wise, I'm in love with my canon T2i and the coupla really good lenses I have.
I actually chose it purely on the image quality and really did not give the actual cam functionality much thought at the time. I had worked in TV for a long time and did not expect to do the same kind of pragmatic jobs with it, only really thought out and rather photographic shots without shoulder cam, zoom and all that jazz.
But as I said, the occasional concert or things like that really become problematic, although you're all right in that I'd better get another cam for that kind of stuff.