Subject:So sad

Posted by: Rickms

Date:9/11/2008 11:47:39 AM

I cannot help but feel saddened for ACID Users who are still waiting for any news that ACID development is actually occurring and that release may occur within this decade.

I've moved on to Reaper but still keep a glimmer of hope that ACID will one day be refreshed and stable enough to actually use for my production needs.

I'm writing this because I also own Sonar (do not use much since moving over to Reaper) and I noticed Cakewalk is doing the typical Fall release. The excitement in the Sonar forum is unbelievable. It just mad be sad thinking about where Sony has let ACID go.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: danika

Date:9/12/2008 7:15:11 PM

I think what has happened is pretty obvious. Acid is alive, well, and thriving as Acid Music Studio, which was exactly Sony's goal. Rumor has had it for over a year now that Sony has deliberatly been putting most of it's marketing and development effort on Acid Music Studio and has been very pleased with the market results, in large part from sales at stores like Best Buy.

Acid was at a crossroads. They had to either beef it up to go against Sonar, Cubase, and Logic or create a consumer product to compete with GarageBand and FL Studio. Acid Pro 6 was a good effort technically, but I'd be willing to bet it struck out in the marketplace, so Sony took the other direction.

That may be little consolation for those of us who know and love(d) Acid Pro, but this is all about economics.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Cheye

Date:9/13/2008 6:36:23 AM

They have said that Acid Pro 7 is in the works many times in this forum, especially from the Sony people. I have even heard it verbally over the phone from Tech support. Is this common practice to say that a new version is coming out and then not put it out? I agree something does seem very wrong with the communication end of things regarding Acid Pro 7 and not to have any updates in 2 years for Acid Pro 6 is also another ominous sign. I think we can realistically say that they have minimal resources and personal working on updates and Acid Pro 7 / 6d. We are in the time game and waiting for the dust to settle and people to move onto other apps. A glimmer of hope is all we have at this point. I would love to see a version of Acid Pro 7 but will work with Cubase and Acid Pro 6 for now.

Cheye

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Patrick@Denman

Date:9/13/2008 7:04:58 AM

I am now almost completely convinced that ACID Pro 7 is dead. You certainly don't hear any more buzz about it, and I don't see those statements any longer about its development status. This is indeed very sad, and it's clear that Sony Creative has completely lost/dropped focus on the product.

I too have moved on to REAPER. Perhaps the single greatest thing about that product is the incredibly energetic and active online community. A few times I've posted there and had responses back within minutes. This forum, on the other hand, is almost completely dead. You can typically leave it for a week and find only 4 or 5 new posts. The simple fact that there are so few queries about how to approach different problems is an indication of lack of interest. You almost get the impression that there are hardly any remaining users.

Another benefit of REAPER is that - initially at least - it resembles the ACID interface, so the learning curve is shorter. But once you peer beneath the covers the similarity disappears pretty quickly. Unfortunately in a number of areas it lacks many of the really cool features of ACID Pro, but personally I'm not finding that to be a problem - most of the missing features apply to audio loop processing, which I don't use much these days.

Nonetheless, I'll continue to check in here occasionally, with faint hope that Sony Creative is actually doing something with AP after all.

Way to kill a great product, Sony.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: JohnnyRoy

Date:9/13/2008 8:29:35 AM

> I am now almost completely convinced that ACID Pro 7 is dead. You certainly don't hear any more buzz about it, and I don't see those statements any longer about its development status. This is indeed very sad, and it's clear that Sony Creative has completely lost/dropped focus on the product.

The death of ACID Pro 7 has been greatly exaggerated! ;-)

What do you want? Do you want Peter to post every day that he made it into work today and is working on ACID Pro 7? He said multiple times that it's in development. I'm not sure what "buzz" you are looking for. Beta testers are under NDA to not say anything so you won't hear a peep from them. How can there be a "buzz"? They said they are working on it. I believe them. <wink><wink>

~jr

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Cheye

Date:9/13/2008 10:04:36 AM

I want to believe, I want to believe, there's no place like home, there's no place like home. Is Acid 7 behind the curtain of OZ?

cheye

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Weevil

Date:9/13/2008 7:39:05 PM

I’m sure Acid Pro 7 will arrive at some point. Less convinced about Sony’s commitment to the project after that.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Patrick@Denman

Date:9/13/2008 7:41:14 PM

JR, I know that you are an unshakably steadfast supporter of this software with a stake in its success, but I don't think it's unreasonable for the rest of us to want to know what the heck is going on with ACID Pro (if in fact there is anything happening at all). It's closing in on two years since 6.0d was released. That is an unusually long time between updates for such a complex piece of software.

And regardless of whether or not ACID Pro 7 is actually in development, the amazingly low activity on this forum is probably a pretty good sign that the number of people out there who are actually using the software is certainly not on the rise, and if anything the number is dwindling. The business managers at Sony Creative must be aware of this, and they're probably not too excited about throwing expensive dev resources at something that probably won't make them much (if any) money.

I really hope I'm wrong about this. But I'll need some evidence to think otherwise.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: JohnnyRoy

Date:9/14/2008 5:38:46 AM

It has been too long. You know... I know it... and Sony knows it! (trust me) ACID Pro 6.0 was such a giant leap forward from previous versions of ACID and then... nothing! I hear you... I hear you... but there are people still using ACID 3 because all they need to do is drag, drop, and paint and they are happy making music with loops.

Let's face it... all of the new functionality is for those of us who wanted our little "music looper" to grow up into a DAW. But for those who just need a music looper, I think they are happily looping. As Peter has said, ACID Pro 7 is in development and you know he visits these forums regularly even if he doesn't comment on every post, and he is painfully aware that you guys are chomping at the bit and is doing everything within his means to give you the release that you want.

~jr

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Cheye

Date:9/14/2008 8:11:41 AM

I definately like the new features of Acid Pro 6 and the attempt to grow towards the other apps. The only reason I purchased Sony Acid 6 was for these new features such as multitrack recording, midi, vst and others. Sony in my opinion went in the right direction for my needs. I want more than a loop player, since I work with loops and of course live recording, midi etc. I love version 6, however, the stability, updates, need attention and a lot of work. If everytime you start a project and have difficulty finishing it due to technical issues, the product needs work. I'm angry that I paid for this product and struggle to complete a project because Acid doesn't seem to work well with my other plugs (UAD-1, Amplitube 2, Atmosphere, Waves). If this improved, I would be on this forum praising and shouting out the wonderful world of Acid. Sony got my money because of the new updates and direction to bring the best loop based player up to snuff with other apps in a simple and easy to use, creative monster machine. They did a great job, but I need updates, new versions, improvements and dedication to the product. Bring it back Sony, bring it back, make it stable, update your software. The only reason this forum may seem dead is because the users do not feel they are being valued and listened to. How can you get excited about a product without an update in two years? How can you believe a new version is coming out without the odd hint of existence. I would like to hear from Peter once again saying, yes, there is a version 7 in the works. Yes, we are trying to address some of the concerns and issues around Acid 6 to 7. I would love to see a tiny indication of direction from Sony. I would love to be restored with some hope that this great software and its huge potential is growing. When people speak out about there displeasure and frustration with the product, throw them a bone of hope, not matter how many times they waiver. The only reason Acid users are wavering is due to the lack of effective communication and support. This software could be amazing as expressed by all of us, even the new bound reapers are coming back to express their concern and hope for some kind of forward movement and development. There is nothing in my experience that works to my creative needs like Acid. Sony, Peter, what do we have at this stage?

Hopeful!?!?!?!????????

cheye

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Patrick@Denman

Date:9/14/2008 8:38:34 AM

You said it, Cheye. Sony's official stance on not talking about upcoming AP releases, nor even giving any official acknowledgment of its development status, is just plain stupid (unless, of course, the product is basically dead - in which case silence is probably better than an obituary from their standpoint). IMHO any responsible vendor who gives a damn about their customer base would recognize the serious situation out here in user land and would at least make some kind of statement in good faith. But the stunned silence we see is damning.

And as we've said before...even if ACID Pro 7 was released NOW, the confidence of its user base has been shattered by this intransigence. How will they convince us to invest more $$$ in a product with such a painfully slow (or completely absent) rate of maintenance? How much longer until the next release? Three years?

The saddest part of this whole experience is the fact that Sony took an awesome product from a small company of committed people, and eventually destroyed the momentum behind its evolution.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: araefm

Date:9/14/2008 8:11:52 PM

Version six was such a great update to the software. I was actually forcing three to do multitracking for a long time. The stability was suspect but I got it to work. Lots of reboots! Same with version four. Didn't mess with version five. Then six came out and I quit using anything else but Acid for recording. From the electronic to the metal, any band I recorded I used Acid. Still not perfect but it would do what I wanted without having to trick it. Handles my external synths well also. Reaper looks like what Acid should be now. Reaper just isn't friendly to external gear.

If they announced that seven was coming close, I would wait but more and more I'm a pushing Acid aside and using other things. If Reaper can get the external hardware thing worked out, I am there!
I have one last little shred of hope that Acid 7 Pro isn't just vaporware but my faith is almost gone............

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: kbruff

Date:9/15/2008 5:27:09 AM

sorry friend...
But FL is well beyond ACID, and it is better than Garage Band.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: SkinnyDevil

Date:9/15/2008 6:12:30 AM

Not sure about buzz or lack thereof, but I was just told by tech support that ACID 7 is due VERY soon (this after my query regarding problems with my old ACID 3 on my new computer). So it's not like they haven;t stopped talking about it.

Re: REAPER - I thought Reaper was amulti-track recorder with mastering suite (essentially Vegas plus SoundForge). Does Reaper also allow use of ACID-ized loops in the same way that ACID does?

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: jumbuk

Date:9/15/2008 4:25:11 PM

I was thinking about this same thing last week while I loaded AP6 (and SF8 and Cubase LE) onto my eeePC 901.

I realised that I don't really care now whether Sony releases AP7 or not. Sure, I'll upgrade when it comes out, but I don't need it.

There is nothing about AP6 that is holding me back. Life's too short to learn another software package - there are songs to record, new songs to write, stuff to do. Even if Reaper, FL, Live etc are demonstrably better (and no one has covinced me they are), I don't have time to sink into learning a new recording environment. And I don't have the stomach for potentially buggy or unstable applications - AP6 has always been rock solid for me (on two different desktops and now on the eeePC). Why change?

PS the eeePC is an amazing little machine. I am running AP and Cubase off the D drive (SSD - there is no hard drive). I have all my Acid loops and my own recordings on a 8Gb SSD card in the card reader slot so I can work on my music wherever I go. If you have seen an eeePC, you will know how small it is to carry around.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: DKeenum

Date:9/16/2008 5:44:46 AM

I'm with jumbuk. Acid 6 is fully functioning and stable. It does what I need it to do. When acid pro 7 is released, I'll move up and learn the new features, but until then I'll use acid 6.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: thirdnostril

Date:9/16/2008 11:55:15 AM

There's been an entire new Windows OS out, for over a year, and SONY didn't see fit to even offer a patch for Vista functionality.

Fully functioning? For YOU, you mean.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Cheye

Date:9/16/2008 4:06:02 PM

There are many documented problems with Acid 6d with regards to stability especially with other plugs and apps. Confirmed problems by Sony techs. As said by third nostril...

Fully functioning? For YOU, you mean

cheye

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: feign

Date:9/16/2008 6:12:15 PM

I didn't realize that only negative comments are permitted in this forum. So I'll break the rule, just like DKeenum did, and point out that Acid Pro 6 is fully functioning for me too. It's probably the single most stable application that I regularly use. The only plugins I've had trouble with are the ones that everyone knows don't work with Acid, such as Melodyne, but this isn't Acid's fault, it's that Melodyne was never tested in Acid by its developers (they seems almost proud of the fact). Probably the same case with other plugin makers. So you can blame Sony (rightfully) for not patching Acid to be compatible with Vista, but at the same time blame various plugin makers for not making their products compatible with Acid.

Sorry to be positive about Acid. please don't throw me out.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: nutrapuppy

Date:9/16/2008 6:46:03 PM

I am with you feign. I just peek in here from time to time to see what is up, but I have used Acid since the first day it came out and 6.0d is certainly the best it has been. And I have let them know when it truly sucked, so its not like i am a brown-noser.

I actually like this long development cycle. I have released a ton of material since 6.0 came out, partially because I am over the learning curve and just concentrating on music.

I think the best way for a forum to pass time during development cycles is to keep up the feature-wish-lists. It is also probably a good idea for a forum community to develop a list of known good and bad plugins. I love my Dave Brown plugs, for instance, but they regularly cause crashes in Acid. Other users should get to know these things before they drop dough.

Best,
NP

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: pwppch

Date:9/16/2008 7:11:29 PM

I love my Dave Brown plugs, for instance, but they regularly cause crashes in Acid.

Are these the Dave Brown plug-ins?

http://www.db-audioware.com/index2.htm

Can you provide details of the problem you are having?

Thanks
Peter

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: nutrapuppy

Date:9/16/2008 10:01:39 PM

Indeed. I have the Quantum FX bundle and the Flying Haggis. I can't be more specific at this time as it has been a while since I messed with it, but give me a couple days. I will open some older projects, replace the Waves plugs with DB plugs, and see what blows up.

Thanks P!

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Patrick@Denman

Date:9/17/2008 1:51:59 PM

Hey Feign...don't take some of our criticisms as an attempt to invalidate your positive experience. If it's really working well for you, GREAT - and nobody can (or should) fault you for that.

I do find it mildly encouraging to hear that support seems to think a release of AP7 is imminent. For myself, though, I'm not sure that it will be enough. It would have to be a pretty rockin' version to even make me think about it, instead of looking elsewhere.

SkinnyDevil: RE: REAPER question...yes, REAPER does recognize ACIDized loops. IMHO it's not as good as ACID for handling these things, but essentially it's possible to do the same work as with ACID. One shortcoming in this area is that with REAPER there is no concept of the project's current key - nor are there key change markers - so any pitch shifting has to be explicitly done to match your composition. And it does have a beat mapping plugin, but from what I know of it (I've never used it), it's no where near as sophisticated as the ACID BeatMapper. On the other hand, for the kind of work I'm doing - almost entirely MIDI-based - REAPER is great. Significantly different from ACID, and truthfully there are some things that I wish it would handle like AP6 (such as using a clip pool), but I'm certainly getting used to it. I guess it all boils down to how you like to work.

Just to emphasize a point: I really DO hope that Sony gets their collective act together and puts out a real butt-kicking version 7, as well as actually thinking more seriously about their marketing of the product to position it right along side the top DAW products, so that they can make some real $$ off of it and recognize its value to them in business terms. AP has so much going for it, it would be a crime to just let it die. Still, I admit I just can't let go of my anger with them for dragging their collective butts the way that they have. Nearly two years since even a maintenance release? That's shameful.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: thirdnostril

Date:9/18/2008 12:24:20 PM

It's not as if this were a music player, or for that matter a microwave oven. It's the software we make music with. SO when it doesn't work, when my soft synths crackle and skip, it isn't a small inconvenience. It's my world screeching to a halt.

Subject:RE: So sad

Reply by: Cheye

Date:9/18/2008 4:10:17 PM

Agreed with Nostril once again. It is software and when I can't complete a project because of problems with many different plugs and other issues which have been mentioned on the forum by many including Sony Tech people, my world also comes screeching to a halt. If only a maintenance update could have come through within 2 years that would have been great, but it did not. I love the product, but I just can't give it a thumbs up. Glad to hear some people have absolutely no problems at all, fantastic, congrats and thank you for your comments.

cheye