Subject:Sound Forge won't lock to Acid via Virtual MIDI Drivers

Posted by: Bat

Date:1/10/2000 8:04:00 PM

Umm... anyone else have this problem? Acid 1.0 or 2.0 will
lock to SF, but SF won't lock to Acid.

I'm opening up a plain old AVI and nothing works. I've
setup S.F. to receive MTC SMPTE non drop 30 on virtual port
1 and ACID to transmit on port 1. No go... I've assigned
the region/track list to smpte as it says to do but no
go...

S.F. on the other hand will cause ACID to play... this of
course is completely useless as there's no way anyone will
sit there hitting play in S.F. in a completly different
window while composing in Acid...

Is there a patch fix? Anything?


Thanks

PS - Does Vegas has MIDI support yet ;-)

Bat

Subject:Re: Sound Forge won't lock to Acid via Virtual MIDI Drivers

Reply by: pwppch

Date:1/10/2000 9:55:00 PM

Sound Forge does not chase to incomming time code, it triggers. If
the time code being recieved is past the trigger point, Forge will
not play the playlist region. So, if you start ACID at a SMPTE time
past the playlist region's trigger time, Forge will not trigger as it
would be "out of sync" with the external master clock (ACID).

Vegas will chase to incomming time code. You can start ACID at any
point in time and Vegas will chase lock to this point in time.

Peter




Peter Stone wrote:
>>Umm... anyone else have this problem? Acid 1.0 or 2.0 will
>>lock to SF, but SF won't lock to Acid.
>>
>>I'm opening up a plain old AVI and nothing works. I've
>>setup S.F. to receive MTC SMPTE non drop 30 on virtual port
>>1 and ACID to transmit on port 1. No go... I've assigned
>>the region/track list to smpte as it says to do but no
>>go...
>>
>>S.F. on the other hand will cause ACID to play... this of
>>course is completely useless as there's no way anyone will
>>sit there hitting play in S.F. in a completly different
>>window while composing in Acid...
>>
>>Is there a patch fix? Anything?
>>
>>
>>Thanks
>>
>>PS - Does Vegas has MIDI support yet ;-)
>>
>>Bat
>>

Subject:Re: Sound Forge won't lock to Acid via Virtual MIDI Drivers

Reply by: Bat

Date:1/11/2000 12:37:00 AM

Peter,

Thanks for the update. FYI, Acid started at smpte 00:00:00 and the
region in Sound Forge /was/ start at 00:00:00 so it should of just
played. It's a bit confusing with Sound Forge however, --- it Sound
Forge just triggering playback of a file at smpte xx:xx:xx or is it
actually locking?

I'd hate to just have to buy Vegas to lock to an AVI with Acid...
WHICH By The Way... Didn't I read somewhere a while back on your site
that Acid 2.0 was /supposed/ to support AVI/MOV playback??!?

Peter


Peter Haller wrote:
>>Sound Forge does not chase to incomming time code, it triggers. If
>>the time code being recieved is past the trigger point, Forge will
>>not play the playlist region. So, if you start ACID at a SMPTE
time
>>past the playlist region's trigger time, Forge will not trigger as
it
>>would be "out of sync" with the external master clock (ACID).
>>
>>Vegas will chase to incomming time code. You can start ACID at any
>>point in time and Vegas will chase lock to this point in time.
>>
>>Peter
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Peter Stone wrote:
>>>>Umm... anyone else have this problem? Acid 1.0 or 2.0 will
>>>>lock to SF, but SF won't lock to Acid.
>>>>
>>>>I'm opening up a plain old AVI and nothing works. I've
>>>>setup S.F. to receive MTC SMPTE non drop 30 on virtual port
>>>>1 and ACID to transmit on port 1. No go... I've assigned
>>>>the region/track list to smpte as it says to do but no
>>>>go...
>>>>
>>>>S.F. on the other hand will cause ACID to play... this of
>>>>course is completely useless as there's no way anyone will
>>>>sit there hitting play in S.F. in a completly different
>>>>window while composing in Acid...
>>>>
>>>>Is there a patch fix? Anything?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Thanks
>>>>
>>>>PS - Does Vegas has MIDI support yet ;-)
>>>>
>>>>Bat
>>>>

Subject:Re: Sound Forge won't lock to Acid via Virtual MIDI Drivers

Reply by: pwppch

Date:1/11/2000 1:13:00 PM

Forge should pick up on the 00:00:00 start. I will verify.

Forge does not chase lock, it only triggers at a specific time. That
is, if the source clock is not exact, Forge does not attempt to
slowdown or speed up. If the time input is past the trigger time,
forge will not jump to the input time.

Where did you read that ACID has video support?

Peter


Peter Stone wrote:
>>Peter,
>>
>>Thanks for the update. FYI, Acid started at smpte 00:00:00 and the
>>region in Sound Forge /was/ start at 00:00:00 so it should of just
>>played. It's a bit confusing with Sound Forge however, --- it Sound
>>Forge just triggering playback of a file at smpte xx:xx:xx or is it
>>actually locking?
>>
>>I'd hate to just have to buy Vegas to lock to an AVI with Acid...
>>WHICH By The Way... Didn't I read somewhere a while back on your
site
>>that Acid 2.0 was /supposed/ to support AVI/MOV playback??!?
>>
>>Peter
>>
>>
>>Peter Haller wrote:
>>>>Sound Forge does not chase to incomming time code, it triggers.
If
>>>>the time code being recieved is past the trigger point, Forge
will
>>>>not play the playlist region. So, if you start ACID at a SMPTE
>>time
>>>>past the playlist region's trigger time, Forge will not trigger
as
>>it
>>>>would be "out of sync" with the external master clock (ACID).
>>>>
>>>>Vegas will chase to incomming time code. You can start ACID at
any
>>>>point in time and Vegas will chase lock to this point in time.
>>>>
>>>>Peter
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Peter Stone wrote:
>>>>>>Umm... anyone else have this problem? Acid 1.0 or 2.0 will
>>>>>>lock to SF, but SF won't lock to Acid.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I'm opening up a plain old AVI and nothing works. I've
>>>>>>setup S.F. to receive MTC SMPTE non drop 30 on virtual port
>>>>>>1 and ACID to transmit on port 1. No go... I've assigned
>>>>>>the region/track list to smpte as it says to do but no
>>>>>>go...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>S.F. on the other hand will cause ACID to play... this of
>>>>>>course is completely useless as there's no way anyone will
>>>>>>sit there hitting play in S.F. in a completly different
>>>>>>window while composing in Acid...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Is there a patch fix? Anything?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks
>>>>>>
>>>>>>PS - Does Vegas has MIDI support yet ;-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Bat
>>>>>>

Subject:Re: Sound Forge won't lock to Acid via Virtual MIDI Drivers

Reply by: Siggi_Churchill

Date:1/11/2000 1:23:00 PM

I've been using Vegas and Acid in sync without problems but haven't
tried triggering SF. One thing I do to make sure Acid and Vegas start
OK is to leave a bar of nothing in acid to allow pre-roll for sync.
This may explain why even though SF is supposed to trigger at 00:00:00
it's not. The first MTC # it see's is probably 10+ frames or even a
full second in. With SMPTE it is essential to start code -30 seconds
from where you actually need it (ie. if I want an event to start at
1:00:00:00 I start stripping code at 0:59:30:00 to allow plenty of
time to sync with pre-roll). With internal sync 30 seconds is a lot
but you will at least need 2-3 seconds of pre-roll. When I sync vegas
to acid all my acid projects start at bar 2.

Peter Stone wrote:
>>Peter,
>>
>>Thanks for the update. FYI, Acid started at smpte 00:00:00 and the
>>region in Sound Forge /was/ start at 00:00:00 so it should of just
>>played. It's a bit confusing with Sound Forge however, --- it Sound
>>Forge just triggering playback of a file at smpte xx:xx:xx or is it
>>actually locking?
>>
>>I'd hate to just have to buy Vegas to lock to an AVI with Acid...
>>WHICH By The Way... Didn't I read somewhere a while back on your
site
>>that Acid 2.0 was /supposed/ to support AVI/MOV playback??!?
>>

Subject:Re: Sound Forge won't lock to Acid via Virtual MIDI Drivers

Reply by: Bat

Date:1/11/2000 5:24:00 PM

Peter Haller wrote:
>>Forge should pick up on the 00:00:00 start. I will verify.
>>
>>Forge does not chase lock, it only triggers at a specific time.
That
>>is, if the source clock is not exact, Forge does not attempt to
>>slowdown or speed up. If the time input is past the trigger time,
>>forge will not jump to the input time.
>>
>>Where did you read that ACID has video support?
>>
>>Peter

It was actually from this web site. It was in the features list of
Acid 2.0 (yet to come) on the site... If I was mistaken, then perhaps
I was dreaming...

I think I know why SF won't lock...er... trigger... I finally got
Vegas to chase to Acid but it's not usable. Even between the apps on
the same machine, there's about a 1.5 to 2 second delay before Vegas
even kicks in. I'm on a P/// 500 too so there's some serious timing
issues happen...

My Macintosh locks within .24 seconds when Acid is sending timecode
via MIDI ;-)

Peter

Subject:Re: Sound Forge won't lock to Acid via Virtual MIDI Drivers

Reply by: Bat

Date:1/11/2000 5:29:00 PM

Thanks Andrew and yes, you're right - it does seem there's a lag
issue going on here...

Eep! 2-3 seconds of deadtime just to sync is pretty long...

My Atari w/Dr.T's Phantom & KCS locked to signal within .5 seconds.
The Mac just as fast.

My Mac locks to Acid in .25 seconds (SMPTE/MTC)so 2 to 3 seconds is
pretty long, especially interapplications... it's workable but get's
tedious doing fx timings and cue points and having to back up 3
seconds all the time.... especially on my P /// 500 ... My atari was
a Mega II... we all know how fast those were... A lot faster then my
Mac 040 @ 25 mhz!

Peter


Andrew Linhart wrote:
>>I've been using Vegas and Acid in sync without problems but haven't
>>tried triggering SF. One thing I do to make sure Acid and Vegas
start
>>OK is to leave a bar of nothing in acid to allow pre-roll for
sync.
>>This may explain why even though SF is supposed to trigger at
00:00:00
>>it's not. The first MTC # it see's is probably 10+ frames or even a
>>full second in. With SMPTE it is essential to start code -30
seconds
>>from where you actually need it (ie. if I want an event to start at
>>1:00:00:00 I start stripping code at 0:59:30:00 to allow plenty of
>>time to sync with pre-roll). With internal sync 30 seconds is a
lot
>>but you will at least need 2-3 seconds of pre-roll. When I sync
vegas
>>to acid all my acid projects start at bar 2.
>>
>>Peter Stone wrote:
>>>>Peter,
>>>>
>>>>Thanks for the update. FYI, Acid started at smpte 00:00:00 and
the
>>>>region in Sound Forge /was/ start at 00:00:00 so it should of
just
>>>>played. It's a bit confusing with Sound Forge however, --- it
Sound
>>>>Forge just triggering playback of a file at smpte xx:xx:xx or is
it
>>>>actually locking?
>>>>
>>>>I'd hate to just have to buy Vegas to lock to an AVI with Acid...
>>>>WHICH By The Way... Didn't I read somewhere a while back on your
>>site
>>>>that Acid 2.0 was /supposed/ to support AVI/MOV playback??!?
>>>>
>>

Subject:Re: Sound Forge won't lock to Acid via Virtual MIDI Drivers

Reply by: pwppch

Date:1/14/2000 8:58:00 PM

Peter Stone wrote:
>>I think I know why SF won't lock...er... trigger... I finally got
>>Vegas to chase to Acid but it's not usable. Even between the apps
on
>>the same machine, there's about a 1.5 to 2 second delay before
Vegas
>>even kicks in. I'm on a P/// 500 too so there's some serious timing
>>issues happen...

By default, Vegas will wait 2 seconds for a time code lock up. This
is can be changed in the advanced page for MTC Input. We chose 2
seconds as there can be many situation where lower times would cause
a poor lock up. Many system dependent issues can come into play. You
may want to lower this. If you are setting up a large number of
busses to different audio ports, then you may have to leave it set to
2 secs. (In some cases it may have to be larger.) Every system is
different and that is why this setting is available.

Even with this delay, the two should lock up. Are you not seeing
this?

Also, by default, Vegas will chase lock. If you are playing both ACID
and Vegas through the same audio hardware or have your audio cards
lock to a common clock, be sure to turn on Trigger only. This is
different than Forge's trigger, so Vegas will always start regardless
of where you start ACID playing.

Peter


>>
>>My Macintosh locks within .24 seconds when Acid is sending timecode
>>via MIDI ;-)
>>