Subject:piano roll

Posted by: rapsnacks

Date:9/19/2007 2:29:52 PM

is there a way you can open up a wav file from the explorer and add it to the piano roll and play it on my midi keyboard? or,do you have to export the wav as a midi file?and if so,how do you do it?
im using a m-audio 49 key usb keyboard with a 1 gig toshiba laptop.


hope im not asking to much.any assistance will be greatly appreciated.
thanx!

Subject:RE: piano roll

Reply by: Chienworks

Date:9/19/2007 2:48:37 PM

I'm not really an expert in this field, so hopefully someone else who is will explain this better ...

The piano roll shows midi data, which doesn't include sound. All you see there is a description of what notes should be played when. The .wav file contains sound. If you want to get this into your keyboard you would have to import it as a sample file. Depending on your keyboard's capabilities and the software you have for it, this may be a simple task or nearly impossible. It's really outside the scope of ACID though.

Subject:RE: piano roll

Reply by: Kennymusicman

Date:9/19/2007 3:49:11 PM

I'm going to generalise a bit here, for simplicity.

The difference between audio and MIDI is huge. I'll explain.

Audio, tells you every nuance of information about that sound - using a guitar as an example, it tells you that it's a stratocaster, set to the bridge pickup, with the vol on 7.6, the tone rolled back a bit, through a marshall amp, with the gain on 7, the mid scooped out a bit, a touch of reverb, close mic'd in a wooden room, play by someone with a short hair cut, in grey jeans and so on and so forth.. Ie, it tells you everything about the sound you can hear.

MIDI, on the other hand, essentially tells you 2 bits of info. What note, and how hard. (yes, I am quite familiar with sysex codes, CC, note on/off and so on, but I am simplifying here). The computer/sound module/wave synth generates an audio sound from a sample stored somewhere (Such as wavtable). For example, the GM (General MIDI) piano may have 3 little samples, 1 @ middle C, 1 two octaves down, and 1 two octaves above middle C. The other notes are created through pitch shifting by the CPU or MIDI synth etc.

Therefore, to turn MIDI into audio, you simply record the audio output of the synth. Easy enough, no problem. (It's why MIDI is not included in export in many audio apps, as it is created in real-time only).

To turn an audio file into MIDI, however, is much more complex. For transcirbing :-If you have a simple sound, such as say a 1 note piano (monophonic) sound, then software can detect this and transcribe for you. If you have a multinote piano sound (polyphonic) then same applies, but more thought required. If you now have a band (many instruments, many sounds), then you get mush.. - I've yet to see anything really successfully work out the sound into MIDI.

Of course, you may just be after a sampler type system, where you hit a note (say middle C) and it plays your audio file. Go up and octave, and your audio file is played an octave up. If so, then you need to get Acid to respond to that audio file as a sampler. In which case, you need a sample VSTi. This is where Reason has its uses with the NN19, and the NN-XT in particular.

The other way is to be able to access the wavetable itself. That is where creative labs where good in the old days, with their soundfont system, but the Reason/VSTi route is better as it allows greater simplicity, and way bigger control and sample sizes.


Personally, I use an external sound module which has built in sampling capabilities for most of it, and Reason when I need to load samples quick.

HTH

Ken

Subject:RE: piano roll

Reply by: tascolas

Date:9/19/2007 7:11:43 PM

hi rapsnacks,
Probably u r looking for a sampler vsti plug-in m8. This will allow u to play any audio file loaded in it as midi information with your keyboard,record it as midi in Acid and view it in the piano roll section as well. On the freeware market the best sampler around must be the paax 2.2(www.kotkasuniverse.com/paax_index.htm) as it allows among other things to import akai & soundfont files as well ,thus opening to u a world of library sounds that have dominated the market for a very long time. Also HighLife from discoDSP (http://www.discodsp.com/highlife/)is very good with interesting features.In the pro market best budget sampler plugin must be Image Line's (of fruity loops fame) DirectWave. At 99 us dlrs and the ability to load wav, sf2(soundfont), akai, gigasampler ,exs24 and ni kontakt formats along with extensive editing of sounds is a bargain imho.
Of course i have to mention the expensive NI Kontakt and IK Sampletank as i am a user of both and i enjoy both machines' features. Kontakt is actually the most capable of all soft samplers avail but Sampletank's simplicity and ease of use is definetely a winner against Kontakt's harder learning curve. Sampletank L goes for around 200 and XL around 400 with NI Kontakt going for around 500. Sampletank lacks giga format support so at its more expensive incarnation i guess its a bit overpriced .Still, its a breeze to work with. Kontakt is worth every penny (if u r able to spend it that is) but at 500 is geared mostly towards pros i guess. Feel free to ask bout anything, i 'd be happy to contribute if i can .Hope this helped m8.
Cheers ,tas :-)
PS:Don't forget that one of the biggest strengths in the various samplers is their ability to load sounds from various format libraries expanding your Acid palette of just audio and midi files. You can find many free sounds in various formats allover the internet and of course there are myriads of them avail to buy as well .

Subject:RE: piano roll

Reply by: rapsnacks

Date:9/19/2007 7:23:34 PM

thanks for the replies,you relieved of alot of confusion and alot of sleepless nights(lol) wow all that time and all i had to do was come into this forum and ask(duuugh!)

thanx a ton guy's,

i really appreciate it.

Subject:RE: piano roll

Reply by: tascolas

Date:9/20/2007 6:11:02 PM

np , anytime ... Just in addition ...If u bought AP6 u can always check a sampler's features by just checking the bundled NI Kompact (Sony version) that comes with your AP6 . The difference from a full fledged sampler is that Sony Kompact is limited as a dedicated sample player that plays its own library (.nki format ). Still, by messing with it u can see how u can edit and manipulate sounds within a basic sampler enviroment plus it has a lot of cool sounds that already come with it. (Ni Kontakt is big brother to Kompakt with so many more features that its impossible to mention).
Cheers again,tas :)

Subject:RE: piano roll

Reply by: rapsnacks

Date:9/20/2007 6:56:51 PM

okay...now i encountered a new problem.

i decided to go with the direct wave plug-in(fl studio)i load the samples just fine play them on my midi keyboard just fine,but when i go to record midi in acid pro,after about 3 notes it crashes.and i have to shut acid down.

is it a memory problem,im working with 1 gig.
im also very,very new to midi,im learning as i go along,so i may be asking you guy's for a bit of help as time goes.(hope you don't mind)

thanx!

Subject:RE: piano roll

Reply by: tascolas

Date:9/22/2007 3:24:55 PM

Give us your full system specs m8 (including software versions),so we can help u ... Also plz describe the procedure you are following to record midi in Acid. Guessing whats wrong with what u give us is quite a long shot...Not a memory problem for sure...Only time u may encounter a problem is trying to load a sample thats quite bigger than your available ram and still this would give u popup error message saying so.

Subject:RE: piano roll

Reply by: Kennymusicman

Date:9/29/2007 11:31:23 AM

In reply to an email - if you don't see a piano roll when you push G - perhaps your track height is too small? - Drag your audio track (the left part, not the editing screen in the right half) downwards (at the very bottom of teh track) so that is becomes taller. Then the piano roll should become much more visible..

HTH

Ken