Subject:can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on spacebar?

Posted by: pivot

Date:8/29/2007 8:23:33 PM

In SF8 "center cursor" was a separate command (e.g. the [.] key).
Pressing space would just move the cursor to the clicked position and not make the window jump.

Now, in SF9 it seems that space and [.] are combined, so not only does the cursor go to the clicked position, but it also jump-centers the window around that position.

This totally kills my concentration in editing long soundfiles, as I constantly have to re-focus on the jumping window.

SF 8 was so simple and smooth: click#1 set the target, space#1 sent the cursor there and then space#2 started playing from that spot. No erratic window re-centering....

going to preferences and selecting space=pause instead of stop only creates another problem: now the cursor doesn't even go to the click-point at all....

Does someone know how to switch back to non-centering SF8 mode?

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: ForumAdmin

Date:9/4/2007 8:11:20 AM

I'm either not seeing this behavior or not following your logic.

If playing, space stops playback and restores the previous cursor position. If not playing, space starts playback from the current cursor position. It does not just move the cursor to the "clicked" position (the click itself does that).

I will guess that you are already playing and referring to the seek-on-click behavior introduced in 9.0. Once you've installed the latest update for Sound Forge 9.0 (9.0c, Build 405), you can disable this behavior by un-checking Options->Seek Cursor on Playback. The default key binding is 'F'.

J.

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: pivot

Date:9/16/2007 12:54:44 PM

thanks J for checking it out,
it is definitely there, it is not the seek-on-click behavior and it keeps driving me back to SF8 (that's why I haven't been in the forum in a while: I've been back using 8).
but now I finally figured out how to replicate it. First I thought it's intermittent, but now I know it only happens in "play as cutlust" mode.
try this workflow:
the goal is to cut out useless pieces from a narrative while making sure there are no clicks, noises etc at the cut points, so the cuts are smooth
set
- play normal mode
- treat as cutlist
then
- play a piece of sound, highlight a section and hit delete: now it's gray
- as reference: in play normal mode, play across that gray section, it is still being played
- now switch to play as cutlist mode so you can figure out what exacly you have cut
- click before the gray section, hit space (cursor goes there, so far so good),
- space again - and this is where the jerking around part happens -
- upon that second space the cursor centers, and even worse, upon space again it "un centers" again to the previous position.
I remember a previous posting here where a jerking window effect was being discussed, that was then fixed for 9b
--> maybe it wasn't fixed for play as cutlist mode?
- I need to do this exact procedure a lot: in play as cutlist, cut something out and then replay to see if I caught everything and the cut doesn't leave a noise
- in SF8 the cursor does not center upon space and the cursor will scroll smoothly to the cut section, jump across it and then move on
- but in SF9 first the window will jerk to center the cursor, then in playing the background moves, not the cursor,and then the background jerks across the cut section
- this is impossible to follow with your eyes

- the one mode that tells me that this must be a bug is:
- playback is stopped, click before the cut region
- hit space once, it jerks to center, hit space again it jerks back again
- I cannot think of a use model where these two jerks are useful, can you?

5 minutes of that and I'm back on SF8

I have done a camtasia video that shows this, in case you can still not replicate it. just let me know hof to get it to you.

play as cutlist is the main mode of operation for me. That's why, as long as this thing is not fixed, I (and pretty much everyone in my company) will have to stick with SF8

and while we are at it:
another useful behavior in SF8 was, for the same purpose, of figuring out if your cut is smooth, try to hear only one edge of a cut region
- create a cut region, highlight part of the sound before (or after) the region and part of the cut region, that way you can see which edge of the cut region makes the noise if there is one
- in SF8 it will only play the highlighted part in "play as cutlist mode", i.e. only the part of the highlight that's not cut
- in addition to jerking around wildly, in SF9 (when not in loop mode) it plays right thorugh the highlight, so the only way of looking just at one edge is to go to loop mode, which is an extra few clicks that weren't needed before, plus looping it isn't really useful if you only want to hear the cut-noise and see it in the waveform
I can do a video for this one too, if that helps.

allowing me to switch these two behaviours on in SF9 would be extremely appreciated

thanks again for looking at this, I'm impressed how you run the forum

regards

pivot

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: Kennymusicman

Date:9/16/2007 1:24:30 PM

I've followed your instructions. I get the to playback before the grey section. Hit play. Cursor does not centre, no screen adjustment at all.
It goes past the cut point, no movement again. I only get movement if the cursor goes outside the window and SF scrolls to bring it back in. I simply turn off that mode, and no screen movement at all....

In fact, to get the centre cursor, I actually have to press the shortcut.

Can you post the URL of your movie, so I can check it out, and compare in case I'm doing something wrong. If I'm not, then I can post a vid back to show you that it's working fine for me, and see where middle ground is.

Ken

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: pivot

Date:9/16/2007 8:18:24 PM

here it is.
the resolution is very low, though, cannot really see the settings.
but I hope it gets the problem across

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-995979392119868164

any place that gives better resolution?

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: PixelStuff

Date:9/17/2007 12:45:32 AM

I just tested SF9.0c on my system and it worked just like you described SF8 working. No jumping around or centering of the clip. No special check boxes altered in the settings either. Basically a default installation.

When I tried the second quirk you described about playing a selection across a cut list it basically ignores the selection. Just plays and jumps across the cut and keeps on playing to the end of the track if I let it. I gathered from your description that in SF8 the playback would stop at the left side of the cut if the selection ended before the right half of the cut?

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: Kennymusicman

Date:9/17/2007 3:19:56 AM

Still got to check the selection-over-cut part, but 9c is working exactly as you want it to for me. ('scuse the question, but you HAVE installed 9c?)

Will look into the other bit a little later and see what I get.

Ken

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: pivot

Date:9/17/2007 10:06:01 AM

yes, duh ;-) 9c, build 405
and since SF8 is doing it, I'm pretty sure it has nothing to do with my PC/graphics card/system etc

so there is no re-centering and all that mess when you click on the play as cutlist (the arrow with the little x) button? while being in treat as cutlist mode?

it would be great if this was just a settings issue. Those two settings (treat as cutlist, play as cutlist) are the only ones that I'm aware of, but I don't fully understand what all those other checkmarks in the prefenrences dialogue do...

is there a way to dump all the SF settings into a text file so I can post them here and we can compare? otherwise I could do a screeshot and post it on some free picture post site (hope the resolution will not kill it again)? there is also email, of course.

any comments on the other thing, playing just one edge of a cut-region?

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: Kennymusicman

Date:9/17/2007 10:43:04 AM

www.soundcraft.org.uk/SF9.wmv

Here is my behaviour pf SF9. It should show the behaviour you desire..

Except the last quirk - with a selection - it ignores the selection anf just jumps to the "post-cut" point. I did put it in video, but I think it chopped it on encoding - I not too bothered about that to redo it... :)

If you agree that the behaviour is indeed good - then we will compare preferences..

HTH

Ken

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: ForumAdmin

Date:9/17/2007 2:32:58 PM

Okay, thanks for the detailed description and video.

I see the same problem here. For those that do not, you need a few cut regions preceding the one you're looking at. This is a bug. The other selection issue is caused by essentially the same problem. I will see that these are fixed up.

In the meantime, a cheap workaround in 9.0 would be to disable scrolling (Options menu or F6) while you are doing this.

Sorry for the inconvenience,
J.

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: Kennymusicman

Date:9/17/2007 3:23:13 PM

Ah - nicely deduced about the extra cut region before hand - was simple to repro after you mentioned that!

At least the answer has been found now.

Ken

Subject:RE: can SF9.0c turn off cursor centering on s

Reply by: pivot

Date:9/17/2007 7:52:07 PM

thanks Ken, J.

I'll wait for 9d then.

continuing to be impressed by this forum....