A very well done film.
Thanks

So, was this cut in Vegas?

Nope, Princeton, New Jersey.
Tor

pretty well made, Extremely biased, but hey - that's what it's supposed to be right?

However Posting it is just asking for a flame war, I won't contribute to it, but I certainly don't appreciate this nonsense (the post not the vid). A single line that is a link to a highly politically charged viewpoint on forums that don't need more of this crap with no explination and no other statement. Why do you do something you know is not appreciated by the forum administration? Would you like me to go around posting Pro War and Pro Bush, and Pro this or Anti that? I appreciate keeping this junk off of here because it only serves to create a flamewar.

Dave

Dave,

I agree with you. A legitimate OT post would be one that relates somehow to the the craft of editing or videography/cinematography.

An editorial viewpoint is not a legitimate OT for this forum. There are plenty of forums for political viewpoints; this post is like subscribing to a Yahoo forum on camcorders and being bombarded with postings for Viagra.

RalphM

Ditto on the flame war. For every anti-bush/war video/point of view there is a pro-bush/war video/point of view.

Let's not travel down that road again on a valuable forum about video editing.

"A legitimate OT post would be one that relates somehow to the the craft of editing or videography/cinematography."

Ralph, I have to disagree slightly here, this is about as legitmately OT as it gets, this is so off topic that it has almost NOTHING to do with video other than the fact that it is one.

:P

Dave

Edit: I believe the word you're looking for is usefull

I agree that emotionally or politically charged material should not be posted without comment, like a land mine.

However, if the poster had offered that the linked clip was a useful example of contemporary documentary editing style, I would say it is an excellent example of such, as distinct from forum rules on material which upsets forum members. The film does make use of the kind of tricks that Vegas does easily--different color FX, film gate FX, L-cuts, J-cuts, juxtaposition of double audio tracks (voiceover and wild for the same person--like the young man doing a rap song into a mike, faded under his own speaking voiceover). The mixing of current and archived material, balancing of closeups, long shots and indoor/outdoor cutaways, and the general structure, builds to a point and tells a story. It is a classroom example of how to edit a piece like this--sensitive subject matter or not. The argument can be made, of course, that charged material in itself, generates new ideas on how best to communicate it, and motivates careful and creative editing.

Although I understand the compulsion to call the subject matter "junk." There is a real tension created when you criticize miltary recruitment policy at at time when there are soldiers in a theatre of war. But editorially speaking, it has to be noted that the statistics quoted when 'squeezing' the frame of the video to one side to make room for text, are from valid sources--another necessary element of making a documentary intended to persuade.
.

Well I enjoyed it.

It gave me great cause to think about the world we live in today, and isn't good art simply a reflection of life as perceived by the artist?

It also was well done - very slick and contemporary in it's style. You could learn a lot of editing technique watching that particualar video. It's what I'd call very "clean" in it's style.

I (personally) don't even think it was a very partisan film. It was simply a document of facts by soldiers, in their own words, who put themselves voluntarily in harms way to protect our way of life. Great inteviews, creat editng, interesting graphics... and a different approach to a very important topic.

I would never have seen this movie if it weren't put on this site by one of my brothers... so thanks.

...er.... and it did say OT - that generally means "not exactly about Vegas.. but something about which I have an interest."

This forum WILL support you - technically and emotionally - but it is not a "Techical support group".

v

Very well produced piece. I'm not quite sure why so many people take offense to a work like this. Why aren't people outraged at the recruiting video and its portrayal of military life as fun and exciting with little or no chance of getting injured or killed. When I talked with a recruiter myself, I was told boot camp wasn't any harder than football practice. Before one makes a decision about anything in life, one should be fully informed. Most of us wouldn't purchase a new camera without reading both the manufacturer's sales brochure AND several reviews critiqueing real world experience with the cam.

P.S. Thank you Patrick. I too would have missed this one.

From a personal standpoint, I'm tired of hearing and reading about liberals, libtards, libs, bleeding hearts, etc. Swinging those words around like a baseball bat simply means you are unwilling to think for yourself and have to be spoonfed information, truthful or not, like pablum to a child.

People who serve our country are the greatest!!! They are all hero's and when they do enlist, I am sure they know there is a war going on and that they may be in the middle of it someday. This, too me is just another anti war-anit Bush video. Nothing new, same old stuff.

mvpvideos2007, my sentiments exactly. I mean, seriously, it wasn't even cut in Vegas.

I have no problem with the post. You can view it or not.
Others have posted of videos on youtube that were not edited in
vegas and no one will say anything. If those with a problem just do not want others to see such a video,.... well, get over it, thats life.

Just my 2 cents, no flames intended.

Terry

Oh none taken Terry, I was just joking. I forget how the internet cuts 93.6% of your delivery. Sorry!

"So, was this cut in Vegas?" - "Nope, Princeton, New Jersey."

LOL

I think it would be offensive to say: check out this video, it's well shot and edited really well too -- it would be taking away from the seriousness of the subject (even though the "well shot and edited" part ads to the video's credibility).

This kind of stuff is really close to my heart because just a few years ago i was seriously trying to convince my brother to join the army as a real alternative to "i don't know what i want to do with my life." Thank God he was smarted than me and didn't sign up.

As whether it's pro or anti-Bush, i think if anything it's “pro serious questioning of the government.” Whether it's republican or democratic gov't we should alway question their motives as they are definitely not there to protect its citizens best interest.

Amen to that.

Smart people are able to learn say filmmaking from anybody, even from those who are too liberal/too conservative/too hip/too boring/use zooms too much/cut off foreheads in interviews/.../insert pet peeve here.

I have a lot of sympathy for the U.S. military staffers who are trying to do their duty in a difficult situation. That is not a Bush issue, I don't think he was involved in those decisions, that would be more Rummy, the brave quarterback civilian who "can do more with the military."

Very nice format for this YouTube piece, relaxed and not that judgmental really. Lots of sympathy for the people involved.

If you're a painter, every so often you have to stop discussing paint mixtures and brushes and actually look at a painting. This thread is hardly off-topic IMHO.

So, Laurence, it's open game to post ANY movie link just because it has editing? I don't think so. There are enough OT threads here that actually do have some relevance so I wish we could lose the political bait threads.

To no one specific:
Go to a non-corporate forum like Google Groups or Yahoo Groups if you want something more open. This is a very specifically targeted forum and I although I'm not particularly a fan of Bush, I'm pretty tired of the need that some people have to regularly OT us into a bash Bush-fest. There are other forums and mailing lists I'm on for random topics and I can go there for that stuff, as can everyone else. This forum is part of Sony's product support, not a regular public forum. It is a place to go to for specific information about Vegas, not a place to vent your political fumes. Really. Please give it a rest. You're not changing anyone's mind.

Other things I'm well aware of and don't really need to read the latest rant on are as follows:

The RIAA sucks. (or sux)
The MPAA sucks (or sux)
Copyright law sucks
Micro$oft sucks (See how clever? A "$" sign! Golly!!! The height of comedy!)
Windoze sucks (Ha ha! Get it? Win-DOZE!!! I'm only 16 so that's funnnny!)
Bill Gates sux.
Bush is Hitler.

We get it. We know your opinion. Thanks. Consider your job done. Pat yourself on the back.

I got a lot more out of this post than many other OT's.
We can spend time reading about were to buy a steak in NYC and then not get a chance to have someone share this piece?
Scary.

this was a bait post, nothing more. It has technical merit and the video is done well, but the post was nothing but a bait post. Putting some other spin on it seems foolish to me. I'll happily admit that the editing was good, the footage was compelling to the topic and the Troops that serve our country are Hero's in my eyes. They have certainly done more to earn their right to free speech than many of us have who enjoy it day in and day out. If this post had been brought up as a, "Creative Edit" or something like that then I would have been on my merry way, but it wasn't, and I find people putting these flame-bait posts tiring. There isn't anything inflamitory about good restaurants in NYC, unless you are strongly opposed to eating out :P

I put down my post not as an opposition to this video, it's content, it's editing or anything else on that end. I put down my opposition because it was blatant flame-bait.

(on a side note, i wonder if this is considered a documentary or if they had to get rights for that US Army commercial? School project fair use is restricted to the classroom as far as I know. Just something that struck me when I was watching it, seems that they were breaking copyright. Anyone know anything about this, for this particular type of instance?).

Dave

Well-made from a technical point of view.

Suppose you do a survey of 1,000 video editors. The subject is Vegas7.

I would not be surprised if 70% are pretty enthusiastic about the product's capabilities, stability, and all-around usefulness. 1% would be rabidly pro-Vegas, to the extent of declaring all other NLEs unworthy of existence. 28% would be mildly supportive of Vegas. Finally, 1% of those surveyed would declare Vegas7 to be utter crap, and that anyone who likes it should be put into an asylum.

Okay, a sort-of bell curve, as expected. Now, let's do a video based on interviews of the 1% who said it was crap. We can post it on YouTube.

Oh, this came out today. Food for thought, yes?

BTW, I've done quite a few interviews with military men. The number one thing I hear from them is that the media is not reporting fairly, and that a majority of the troops have high morale, that most of the troops that are there in Iraq are proud to be there. There was a story in the post that I read a while back... A soldier stood up at a meeting with move on.org and some other group, and voiced his frustrations with the situation with his congressman (one of the speakers at the event taking questions) who was talking about the low morale of troops etc... this is a snipet from the story.

"The morale of the trigger-pulling class of today's fighting force is strong. Unfortunately, we have not had a microphone or media audience willing to report our comments."

I believe that All citizens have a right to express their views on this important national challenge, and all should be heard. Our vets ask no more, and they deserve no less. I have nothing against the vets who speak out against this war but I also have personal experience with troops who are very frustrated that those who aren't opposed to this war are ignored and they serve in the war, they're in the same danger, and ignoring them is a "slap in the face" to those who are fighting and dying for their country and a cause that they believe in. I don't want this to become a flame war, but I DO want to bring some balance to this thread. This is my experience with those I have interviewed, and the post story I mentioned was just to back up my local experience.

Dave