Subject:Mic recommendation for narration

Posted by: feign

Date:5/10/2006 6:55:35 PM

This isn't exactly about Acid, but related. I use Acid Pro extensively to produce soundtracks for short animations. Most of these projects have dialogue and voice-over narration. Now I'm asking you sound pros for a recommendation for a proper mic.

My setup is currently using an M-Audio Delta 66 card with an Omni I/O breakout box with proper XLR and TS inputs (and switchable phantom power). But I am in a small enclosed office that is absolutely not set up for soundproofing or proper acoustics. This setup cannot be changed, so I don't really want advice about the room setup. That is a project for later.

Before I installed the Delta 66 (today), I've been using a pair of Core Sound cardioid stealth mics plugged directly into my (now discarded) Soundblaster. The CS mics did a remarkable job in omitting background noise, and picking up voices with warmth and none of the tunnel effect that I used to get with cheaper mics. But now that I have a proper mixing box, it's time to upgrade the mic.

The main purpose is for voice narration and character dialogue recording, most likely directly into Acid Pro 6, and not for musical vocals. My main criteria are: 1) A warm and natural sound that is appropriate for spoken dialogue; 2) isolating the voice so as not to pick up background noise; 3) No hollow tunnel effect or echoes caused by the non-soundproofed office walls. I don't think I want something that is TOO tightly focused unidirectional, especially because it's hard to discipline kids to sit still in one exact position during recording (adults too!). My little cardioid mics seemed to have the right amount of focus. So I think maybe I'm looking for a better cardioid type mic. But I'm not sure.

I'm looking for two recommendations: 1) Something for under US$100; or 2) Something in the $100-$200 range.

Any and all serious advice is wanted!

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: switchman

Date:5/10/2006 8:36:48 PM

i notice the new tech mags are advertising a samson usb connection mike that will plug straight into your computer, not sure on the price, but the website is www.soundtech.co.uk

also for a couple of hundred bucks is the refexion filter from SE which is labeled as a portable vocal booth, www.sonic-distribution.com

hope my 2 cents helped!

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: feign

Date:5/10/2006 11:23:31 PM

Thanks. Definitely don't want a USB mic, since I want to be able to mix it through my Omni mixing box, so a normal condensor mic is the answer (I think). The SE Reflexion Filter looks like exactly what I need. But no one seems to sell it!

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: jumbuk

Date:5/11/2006 4:32:24 AM

I like the AKG C100S. It is a cardioid with a removable insert that makes it a hyper-cardioid. One advantage is that it can hold a 9V battery if you don't have access to phantom power. It is a great mic for acoustic guitar and flutes, plus I have used it for recording spoken word as well. I have had two of them for about 10 years. Rode also make a similar shape and size (can't remember the model) and so do Behringer (naturally!).

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: drbam

Date:5/11/2006 6:58:26 AM

The Audio Technica ATM25 has been called a "poor man's RE20." Its mostly used on drums (great on toms) but obviously can do what you want. Its a dynamic mic and usually can be found on ebay for about $100 plus or minus a few $. Depending on your voice, you might also consider an SM58 which is even cheaper.

(edit) I just re-read your post and see that you'll also be recording children that may be moving around. Therefore, in your price range I'd suggest the Studio Projects B1 (a cardioid condensor) but since your room isn't treated, you need to build some sort of makeshift, portable "voice over box." This can be done very simply with some spare pieces of wood and foam to reduce (even eliminate) room reflections. You can even use large floor pillows for this by creating a kind of open box on a table with them and place the mic inside. Do a search on "voice over" and you may even come up with some visual plans for such a thing (I recall seeing this a few years ago).

drbam

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: feign

Date:5/11/2006 8:11:29 AM

Thanks for all the recommendations so far. I am looking into all these mics. Someone else recommended the Behringer B-2 Pro, which is switchable between omni and cardioid. That one sounds very tempting (of course, I have to try these mics out if I can find a source where I live). Anyone have experience with the Behringer?

I love the idea of the voice over box made from pillows or foam. Great suggestion!

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: JohnnyRoy

Date:5/11/2006 8:12:12 AM

I would definitely take a look at the Audio-Technica AT2020. For $99 it is an exceptional side-addressing microphone. Add a pop-filter in front of it and let the kids have at it. I have one and it really sounds great.

Here is a video on the VASST site to show you how to build an inexpensive and portable table-top vocal box.

~jr

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: drbam

Date:5/11/2006 8:29:56 AM

In an untreated room, and omni mic will sound terrible as it will amplfy every acoustic problem you have. I wouldn't spend any money for this feature in your particular circumstances.

JR is right about the AT 2020 – it has consistently received rave reviews as a "best buy" product.

The video is great and is exactly what I was trying to describe in my earlier post.

drbam

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: feign

Date:5/11/2006 5:11:54 PM

True that I won't need omni recording for voiceovers. I'm thinking of its potential use for recording ambiences: like going into bars and restaurants or out on the street to record environmental backgrounds. But then I'd need a whole new portable rig.

One more question for you folks: between something like the AT 2020 and the Behringer B1, which is equivalent in price and features, I note that the B1 comes with a shock mount and the AT2020 doesn't. This is an issue for me, since the mic has to be mounted on a desktop, where even now my little stealth mics pick up machine hum that is conducted through the desk. No space for a floor mount, and people simply sit at my desk chair (or in the case of kids, spin around in it!) to record.

Any opinions about the relative advantages between these two mics? They're the same price and same specs, and the Behringer also has a bass roll-off switch, which MIGHT be useful in my environment. But if the AT 2020 has significantly better sound, that makes a huge difference too.

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: drbam

Date:5/11/2006 8:28:11 PM

Well all I can suggest is to do some searches and read the reviews on the 2 mics you're considering. I think you'll be lucky to come up with one or two that might say decent things about the B1 (I haven't heard it and it may be an ok mic) but the 2020 has been tried and tested and has nothing but rave reviews. Generic 3rd party shock mounts aren't that expensive and you can roll off any excess low end within Acid. In terms of the kind of ambience you mentioned, I personally think a cardioid condensor would suffice. But if you really want an omni for ambience, pick up a Behringer ECM8000 ($50). Its probably the best product Behringer has ever produced and is perfect for that kind of thing.

drbam

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: Zacchino

Date:5/12/2006 9:56:50 AM

Definitely a RE20. One of nowdays Radio Broadcasting studio standard.

http://www.electrovoice.com/Electrovoice3/products.nsf/pages/RE20

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: JohnnyRoy

Date:5/12/2006 10:44:14 AM

> Definitely a RE20. One of nowdays Radio Broadcasting studio standard.

... and where is he supposed to get a $400 EV RE20 for $100-$200? The question was not what is the best VO mic, but what is the best VO mic in that price range. If he wanted to spend that much I’d recommend an Audio-Technica AT3060 tube mic or the AT4033 which is another “industry standard”. But that wasn’t the question. ;-)

~jr

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: Zacchino

Date:5/13/2006 8:23:45 AM

Oops, my bad, didn't read the whole post.

JR, you said the AT4033 is another industry standard, but for what kind of application ? I'm planning to buy an AT4060 (what do you think about it? Sorry for the quick OT btw).

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: StrobeAlific

Date:5/19/2006 10:33:58 PM

For the price range you are asking:

Marshall V6

http://www.mxlmics.com

Incredible microphone for voiceover work. I've also used it for String Bass and Cello with much joy.

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: JohnnyRoy

Date:5/20/2006 7:44:27 AM

> you said the AT4033 is another industry standard, but for what kind of application ?

The AT4033 is great for voice over or singing vocals or even instruments like acoustic guitars. It was so popular that when Audio-Technica discontinued it, studios complain and they re-issued it as the AT4033CL (CL= classic) which is the version I have.

> I'm planning to buy an AT4060 (what do you think about it? Sorry for the quick OT btw).

I have never used the AT4060 but it has got to be awesome because I used the AT3060 (the $500 little brother) for a project and it was warm and beautiful; just an incredible sounding tube mic. There’s nothing like tubes. I may pick up the AT3060. If you can afford the AT4060 I’d say go for it.

~jr

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: drbam

Date:5/20/2006 9:04:59 AM

I've found that there are 2 potential drawbacks to using LDCs for VO:
1) they are more prone to picking up mouth noises such as lip and tongue clicks, tics, smacks, etc.
2) They are also very sensitive to proximity effect.
How relevant these issues are is very much dependent on the skills of the performer and to a lesser extent, the characteristics of each specific mic.

drbam

Subject:RE: Mic recommendation for narration

Reply by: Laurence

Date:5/20/2006 8:11:37 PM

I did a voice over recently with a Rode Videomic. It sounded wonderful. Natural speech rather than a "radio voice". Exactly what I wanted.