Subject:How Dare You!!

Posted by: Ranger Bob

Date:5/15/2006 1:31:57 AM

"How dare you say anything bad about my Acid Pro 6!!" Every time someone starts a post pointing out the serious problems with the new Pro 6, we get the "hear no evil, see no evil" guys that don't want to hear it. Just because the basic editing tools that worked perfectly in all the older versions don't work or the program crashes if you look at it funny, so what? I'll tell you so what, I paid for a program that does not deliver. I assumed adding new features didn't mean undoing old features to balance things out. Any kind of decent testing would've found these bugs easily before this long awaited update. If you're only using this program for inserting prerecorded loops with no real editing, then no wonder you haven't found the new bugs. This program does so much more. Over the years, recording studios have started to make Acid Pro an integral part of their setup. It's easy to use right out of the box, and once you've played with it a while, the editing capabilities are the practically unlimited. I have Sonar Producer which is a great, but very different program.
Now, it's too late to turn back, I'm forever hooked on Acid Pro, but not the Pro 6. The new features are useless when it crashes under the least bit of stress in front of studio customers. I'm forced to finish the projects I've already moved to the new version. All new projects will be with the old Acid.

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: JohnnyRoy

Date:5/15/2006 6:25:12 AM

> I paid for a program that does not deliver.

And whose fault is that? You had a full 30-days to try this software before you purchased it. Why didn’t YOU find all the bugs then? You have no one to blame but yourself for purchasing software that you have 30-days to evaluate, but did not.

You have some very legitimate concerns. Sony has changed the way some things work in ACID 6 but have not documented this. I believe that software companies have just as much of an obligation to tell their customers what it has changed and what it has removed JUST as much as what is new but unfortunately this is not always the case.

Document the problems you are having so the Sony engineers can look into them. If Sony broke your workflow, start a new thread and ask why they did this.

“How dare you” NOT complain with excruciating detail so that Sony can make ACID a better product. ;-)

~jr

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: Iacobus

Date:5/15/2006 10:15:42 AM

Ranger Bob: May I ask what exactly it is you were trying to do when ACID crashed? We're not mind readers, you know.

(Yeah, I could fish for your other posts, but why even bother? That's not my job.)

Iacobus

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: jumbuk

Date:5/15/2006 8:11:33 PM

I guess I am probably one of those you see as being overly defensive of Acid!

The problem with all these "Acid is crap" posts is that they are completely pointless. Too often, there is no information that would enable other users to help out. Too often they sound like the poster just doesn't want to be helped - they just want to make the rest of the forum listen to their whinges. Too often, the supposed bug has turned out to be a user error or misunderstanding.

This is a user forum, not a Sony support interface. If I can help other users with my (limited) knowledge of the software, I will. If a problem turns out to be a genuine bug, I will join in with everyone else and ask that it gets fixed. I just don't want to listen to pointless threads that go nowhere. If you have a problem, please post details and we will all try to help you.

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: Ranger Bob

Date:5/16/2006 3:30:07 AM

I installed the trial and was so excited about the new Vegas style multi track recording and the enhanced midi I thought it was great. I was looking for bugs in the new features, NOT the old features that have already been bug free for years.
(Time Selection Tool) Now you can no longer use the time selection tool on individual tracks, the tool only works properly when all track are selected. In the past being able to copy and paste any bit of a track (or a few tracks) was one of the main editing tool that made Acid so great.
(Beatmapping) When you record a beatmapped track and play it back at the original tempo, it's so full of transient artifacts it sounds like you're doing a major time stretch on it.
(VST) Several VST plug-ins now have trouble working properly. The AmpliTube (IK Multimedia) works fine until you try to start tweaking it, then it freezes. It works perfect in the old Acid. Native Instruments B-4 has the same problem in the new Pro 6.
Yes it is my fault for buying the program so I have no right to say anything. I tried to work around some of these bugs but the sudden crashes (when you copy and paste a certain way), can be frustrating. Yeah, I know, that's my fault, so I won't copy & paste in such a way as to upset the new program. As I learn to back off using my old favorite features and plug-ins, it seems to work pretty good. Until I'm ready to spend the money on Cubase, I'll stop complaining.

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: kbruff

Date:5/16/2006 6:05:45 AM

Rangerbob -- I understand that you are feeling aggravated....

Here is my offering to you....
Keep Sony ACID Pro 6 on your computer let it sit there don’t turn on it just let it sit there, in your free time read the PDF manual just to increase your familiarity with the functions and features. It is very likely that they may get AP6 release e before it behaves without peculiar hick-ups.

I myself have found various glitches (yes I reported them, although they are hard to reproduce, they do occur). There are some other annoyances that I would prefer not to experience. I purchased it since the price is at low, and I kind of sort of have faith they will get it right, they have to get it right because the music production world is quickly surging ahead and there are so many great tools that can easily offer you superb functions and stability, provided you are not locked into the Sony Sound Forge Camp.

For example...

FL-Studio can be used to produce incredible results (the producer edition provides users free updates for life! That is right new features for life; within 6 months of the most recent release the programmers stabilized the bugs and glitches). Additionally they offer incredible patches, samples and tips all for free and you can actually use the forum to communicate with the program authors.

FL Studio rewires into Pro-Tools / Cubase / Ableton Live (maybe others) – with no issue at all, I can say that I have not (I repeat – not) gotten FL to rewire into Sony Acid 6 with some sudden crash, etc.

So instead of becoming annoyed….

I simply let Acid 6 sit there until I have confidence that it will work the way I expect it to.

My advice is to try a few other programs, it may increase your skill set. Seeking additional options often permits me to work around limitations and have the confidence that somehow I can get this job done.

Will I go back to ACID – most likely (I will still export my ACIDIZED loops into ACID (made from FL Studio), but only after I have regained my confidence into this program.

You mentioned CUBASE, if you purchase one of many various quality hardware interfaces such as: pre-sonus/Yamaha/omega – you can get a starter edition of Cubase basically free!

Give it try – but keep in mind ACID is promising, so don’t back away to quickly!

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: randygo

Date:5/16/2006 9:48:19 AM

>FL Studio rewires into Pro-Tools / Cubase / Ableton Live (maybe others) – with no
>issue at all, I can say that I have not (I repeat – not) gotten FL to rewire into
>Sony Acid 6 with some sudden crash, etc.

I am eagerly awaiting the patch for this so I can run FLStudio as a VSTi. Until then, Acid is rather broken as a host.

I am quite surprised that this and all the other VST instruments like Microtonic, Jamstix, etc., that require clock and tempo information were never tested. Or perhaps they were working and some last minute patch was applied before release without doing a full regression test.

But, I am happy enough with the other improvements in Acid that I will patiently wait for a fix.

Cheers,

Randy

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: Spectralis

Date:5/16/2006 12:39:48 PM

There do seem to be some VSTi bugs that are annoying but overall I'm pleased with the new release.

I do find it frustrating when people completely denigrate ACID 6 without being specific. There are a number of occassions when reading the manual will resolve a problem.

All in all I think it's worth waiting for the update rather than changing to another host. In my experience no host has been perfect on an initial upgrade.

It is difficult to figure out how Sony managed to mess up the VSTi implimentation again after almost fixing it in v5 but then the upgrade was rather extensive.

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: djHSL

Date:5/16/2006 4:21:39 PM

I share the frustrations, and it is going to cost me money.

I'm a Music Studio user. I'd like to move to Pro. I can do it now, at a discount, but:

1. When I installed the demo of Pro it broke my Music Studio. I posted about this at the time, but didn't get any fix information. The only solution was to uninstall Pro.

2. I depend on uTonic. That's not working.

So, I have to choose between potentially saving some money on something which I know doesn't work and for which there is no forecast correction time, or keeping working with what I've got.

The test manager (assuming there is one) for Acid needs to review his processes. A much more thorough set of test cases is needed.

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: pwppch

Date:5/16/2006 8:24:34 PM

>>2. I depend on uTonic. That's not working.

Can you elaborate? The more details the better.

Peter

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: pwppch

Date:5/17/2006 5:19:38 PM

>>2. I depend on uTonic. That's not working

uTonic depends on the host providing tempo and timing information. This is a known issue in ACID 6 and has been addressed for the update.

Peter

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: deusx

Date:5/17/2006 5:35:16 PM

>>>uTonic depends on the host providing tempo and timing information. This is a known issue in ACID 6 and has been addressed for the update.<<<

Of course you could turn this around ( and all of the other VST plugs ) and blame those for not playing nicely with acid..

Obviously it's better to have acid work with as many different configurations, but it does what it's supposed to do. Just because some of the configuratios do not work doesn't mean it's acid's fault.

I can use loops or music I record myself and mix it up . That is what the basics of acid are. If somebody needs a trillion different plug-ins to create music, it's not acid's fault either. maybe it's time to learn a few real instruments, now that acid lets you record live.

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: pwppch

Date:5/17/2006 8:08:39 PM

Well, I can see - and appreciate - your point of view, but this one is clearly on ACID's shoulders.

ACID 4/5 and provided accurate timing information for VST Insturments. ACID 6 is just broken in this regard. It has been fixed and will be released as part of an update.

Peter

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: jumbuk

Date:5/17/2006 8:37:55 PM

"Well, I can see - and appreciate - your point of view, but this one is clearly on ACID's shoulders.

ACID 4/5 and provided accurate timing information for VST Insturments. ACID 6 is just broken in this regard. It has been fixed and will be released as part of an update.

Peter"

Good one Peter - straight and direct as usual!

I guess there is no point in asking how long before the update, is there?

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: pwppch

Date:5/17/2006 11:35:10 PM

>>I guess there is no point in asking how long before the update, is there?<<

Nope.

When it is done, it will appear.

Peter

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: PeterWright

Date:5/18/2006 6:09:28 AM

Peter
Sincerely, thanks for coming back. Please don't rush - when it is done, I look forward to its appearance. I for one don't mind waiting (and please don't change its skin to lap dancing or something ; )

I think it would be nice if every new poster, in their own way and style, would acknowledge that they know that we are close to having a world-beating program.

It is in everyone of our interests that Acid fulfills its potential and gives us the ability to make wonderful music.

Peter

p.s. Isn't it amazing how musically deep our "demands" are for a $129 upgrade!

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: Iacobus

Date:5/18/2006 10:13:37 AM

PeterWright said: "p.s. Isn't it amazing how musically deep our "demands" are for a $129 upgrade!"


Yeah, ya bunch of divas. Back in my day, we had to scrape rocks together to make music instead of lettin' some highfalutin machine do the job.

*runs away*

Iacobus

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: switchman

Date:5/18/2006 11:03:40 PM

peter-
sorry about the earlier case of ass. i have taken my medication and feel much better now. :) look forward to the update and thanks for returning.

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: pwppch

Date:5/19/2006 10:46:16 AM

No problem. I over react a bit as I take ACID very seriously.

All is good and the ACID update will make much of these issues moot.

Peter

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: kbruff

Date:5/19/2006 11:19:10 AM

Well -- here is one itsy bitsy thingy wingy -- are you guys testing for rewire issues -- I really want to link my FL with ACID (and not pro-tools). Please Please Please -- for some reason it just does not work right -- I dont know the technical reasons why -- but for now -- I simply export -- the tracks -- as ACIDized files -- edit in Sound Forge and then load into ACID -- I would rather to have the real time sync -- commit the necessary edits and then render my ACID project, thereby take Fl out of the loop.

Thanks -- SONY TEAM

Subject:RE: How Dare You!!

Reply by: SHTUNOT

Date:5/19/2006 1:37:20 PM

Warning!!!!!!!

Do not get the rewire update for windows 1.7. I installed it on my system and now I can't get acid to work together with reason without it first acting sluggish and then crashing out acid.

Though if any of you HAVE downloaded and updated already and are experiencing anything different I'm all ears.

Ed.