Subject:AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Posted by: 7starmusic

Date:4/19/2006 5:57:39 AM

I am trying to decide whether I should upgrade my AP4 to AP6. I currently have a Roland VS2480 and I am wondering if anyone has had any success with integrating this unti with AP6.

Please let me know your thoughts and let me know which MCU you have successfully integrated.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: Zacchino

Date:4/19/2006 6:01:16 AM

Bump !
I'm looking forward for feedback on Control Surfaces.
Especially from users that own :

- Tascam FW-1082 / FW-1884
- M-Audio ProjectMix I/O

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: Illogical

Date:4/19/2006 6:23:51 AM

Someone else gave a big thumbs up to the Behringer B-Control...I've got one ordered, I'll let ya know how it works when it shows up.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: MarkWWW

Date:4/19/2006 10:46:14 AM

The Tascam's I'm not certain about but since they emulate the Mackie Control Universal they should be usable with Acid6 (and Vegas6) in MCU emulation mode.

The ProjectMix can definitely be used with Vegas6 in MCU emulation mode and should be just as usable in Acid6 I would think. Have a look at this thread where you can see some discussion by people who have succesffully got it working with Vegas6.

My own preference (if you can't afford a real MCU) is for the Behringer BCF2000 which again emulates the MCU and works just fine with Vegas6 and Acid6.

Mark

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: ifonline

Date:4/19/2006 3:27:20 PM

Get the MCU. It's expensive, but it is what every other control surface emulates. I had the ProjectMIX I/O and a Tascam FW (at different times), but I ended up taking both back and spending the money on the MCU. Very happy that I did.

And with only a few exceptions (that are being fixed), ACID Pro 6 works very well with the MCU.

-----
Please let me know your thoughts and let me know which MCU you have successfully integrated.
-----

And just a pet-peeve, the MCU is the Mackie Control Universal. It is not synonymous with ANY control surface.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: Zacchino

Date:4/19/2006 4:31:57 PM

To ifonline :
>I had the ProjectMIX I/O and a Tascam FW (at different times),
>but I ended up taking both back and spending the money on the MCU.
>Very happy that I did.

This is an interesting experience (really). Can you tell us why you switched back ?

Don't you miss the 2 front headphone outputs ? The ability to control your monitors from one board, the ability to control directly the mic/line inputs, and its routing ?

Thanx in advance for the feedback

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: ifonline

Date:4/19/2006 5:36:26 PM

What worked for me, and may not for others is this:

- One Mackie BigKnob DAW audio control unit.
- One Mackie Control Universal.

I ended up with this setup because the other solutions either lacked a scribble strip or couldn't emulate the MCU properly. The ProjectMix was a very nice unit, as was the Tascam, but in the end, I decided that if these (and all other units) were trying to BE the MCU, then why not GET the MCU? Besides, I don't need real-time audio input and routing. With the BigKnob, I can certainly accept audio input into my DAW (for samples and such), but I don't need an audio mixer. Everything I do is in the digital realm and is handled by the DAW/MCU combo. Additionally, the BigKnob gives me the dual headphone support that I lost when returning the ProjectMix.

Hope I explained this well enough... I'm not always the clearest when offering explanation.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: SHTUNOT

Date:4/19/2006 5:55:09 PM

My setup is the same as yours:

-Mackie MCU.
-Big Knob.

I also use:

-Maudio midisport 2x2 [my mackie and my midi keyboard uses this via usb to PC]
-UC-33E usb controller.
-TriggerFingers.
-Contour shuttle Pro 2

I'm looking to upgrade from my delta 1010 to a presonus firepod asap. It'll free up a pci slot by going I/O via firewire. I'll then be able to put my UAD card in said PCI slot which will finally give it its own IRQ. [It's sharing with something I forgot what].

IMHO you can't go wrong with the MCU. I got mine during some special for $899. Traded in some gear too to knock off some of the price. Would do it again in a heartbeat.

My hope is that we'll have C4 support in Version 7. It would "well round" the mixing experience.

Ed.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: Illogical

Date:4/19/2006 6:03:13 PM

"IMHO you can't go wrong with the MCU. I got mine during some special for $899. Traded in some gear too to knock off some of the price. Would do it again in a heartbeat."

But what does it do that the $200 Behringer B-Control (the one w/8 motarizedfaders and 8 rotaries plus transport controls) doesn't do?

I understand some people don't like Behringer for ethical or political reasons, but it's pretty hard to justify (in my mind, at least) paying five times as much for the same product.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: SHTUNOT

Date:4/19/2006 7:31:13 PM

Would you call a hyundai accent and a Sonata the same product? Or a sony track compressor to a UAD 1176LN the same product?

Nothing I write here makes a difference if your watching what you spend. I did a google search and it looks like a nice product but again I have to actually work with it to see how well the faders react and "feel".

The behringer has all the root stuff down it seems. Does it run on the mcu spec or a emulated one? Whatever floats your boat really.

With the MCU I just connect it and acid finds it and it's ready to go out of the box. And I have a LOT of additional buttons to put shortcuts too for editing.

I'll post some more later on my MCU experiences. To be honest I think the behringer is a great deal for the money. Though I wouldn't be trading in my mackie any time soon either.

Ed.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: ifonline

Date:4/19/2006 8:06:41 PM

My complete setup:

- PC with dual monitors
- Mackie BigKnob
- Mackie Control Universal
- M-Audio MidiSport 4x4 MIDI interface
- M-Audio Delta 2496 audio card
- M-Audio KeyStation Pro 88 keyboard

I use the Delta MIDI for the KeyStation and the MidiSport for the MCU (and extenders, when I get them). I don't use the USB for the KeyStation because I prefer the ASIO low-latency MIDI over the USB.

-----
But what does it do that the $200 Behringer B-Control (the one w/8 motorized faders and 8 rotaries plus transport controls) doesn't do?
-----

A lot, actually:

- Scribble strip
- SMPTE display
- A third display (a function that eludes me at the moment)
- Motorized, touch-sensitive, long throw faders
- Dedicated transport controls
- Shuttle control
- Dedicated buttons for Record Arm, Mute, Solo, and Select
- Channel activity light
- LED pots with push button functions
- Dedicated buttons for EQ, Pan, AUX 1, AUX 2, etc. that remap the pots to various functions
- Function buttons
- Other control buttons
- The de-facto standard that all other controllers emulate
- It's a Mackie

All of the buttons are pre-labeled, and you have the option of adding lexan overlays for specific functions for the specific software package that you are using.

The bottom line is, if you have the money, and as I said before, I highly recommend the MCU. The Behringer is a fine product, but there really is a huge difference in the two. I had difficulty finding an MCU to examine in a store (and as a result I bought it blind), but if you can find one, do a side by side comparison with the Behringer (or other controllers, for that matter).

Ultimately, pick the one that offers the most features for the best price for you.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: SHTUNOT

Date:4/19/2006 8:27:43 PM

"I don't use the USB for the KeyStation because I prefer the ASIO low-latency MIDI over the USB."--

I actually have my Midi controller routed through my midi sport as well. You notice a difference? Again I have both my MCU and my Fatar studio logic 88 weighted key midi controller going to the same device.

I'm a guitar player with some piano chops. But a friend of mine who can play piano didn't notice the difference. What buffer are you set to? I'm always in ASIO @ 512 buffer. Lower if needed.

Ed.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: ifonline

Date:4/20/2006 5:40:49 PM

On my system at least, yeah, I have noticed a difference with latency. The USB direct from the KeyStation to the PC was obviously late. Playing a grand piano with this setup was a horrible experience. When I researched ASIO MIDI latency and plugged in that way, it was perfect. I haven't tried into the MidiSport simply because it ultimately connects via USB. The ASIO MIDI is excellent.

As I understand it, ASIO MIDI is communicating with the software on a core level that USB just can't get to. My terminology may be off, but the end result is extremely low latency MIDI.

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: pwppch

Date:4/20/2006 10:23:46 PM

Not sure what you are saying here, but to clear up what appears to be some confusion.

There is no such thing as "ASIO MIDI".

ASIO is an audio streaming model and does not handle MIDI input or output.

ACID uses standard Windows MME MIDI drivers for input and external output.

Peter

Subject:RE: AP6 and Control Surfaces.

Reply by: ifonline

Date:4/21/2006 4:40:58 AM

Okay... what ever it's called. I use ASIO for audio, true, but I thought it had something to do with MIDI hardware implementation as well. Nevertheless, MIDI through the card has been much more responsive that MIDI through USB, at least for me.