Subject:wave hammer

Posted by: fafow

Date:3/1/2006 3:26:33 PM

In SF 7 the threshold on the volume maximiser of the wave hammer had no effect. When the audio was being increased, it increased all audio regardless of the threshold that was set. Does anyone know if this has been corrected in version 8? This alone would justify for me the cost of upgrading.

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: jumbuk

Date:3/5/2006 2:10:42 PM

Don't know about SF7, but SF8 works fine.

Not sure exactly what you mean. How could it increase all audio regardless of the threshold? Wouldn't that create clipping? A maximiser actually reduces levels above the threshold, then compensates by pushing up overall gain. Does the reduction meter show more reduction (red) when you increase the threshold?

PS If SF7 doesn't work properly, I would be complaining. You should not have to pay for an upgrade to fix basic functionality.

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: Geoff_Wood

Date:3/6/2006 12:26:24 AM

WaveHammer worked fine in 7, and 8.

geoff

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: fafow

Date:4/10/2006 7:40:08 AM

jumbuk, sorry about the late reply things have been a bit hectic around here lately. The problem I am experiencing is something I had seen other people complain about in this forum and it appeared that Sony didn't see it as serious enough to correct. I have been converting cassette tapes to mp3 files and need to do a lot of cleanup on the audio. some of these tapes are 30 years old. The wave hammer volume mazimiser (from my understanding) should allow me to set a low-end threshold of the lowest volume that I want increased. By setting this I can increase only the sound I want and leave the low-level noise and hum where it is. No matter where I set the low end threshold, when I increase the volume, all the sound (including the low level noise and hum) is increased to match the max volume that I selected. As a result I end up with a whole lot of noise that now needs to be cleaned up with the noise reduction plug-in. This is very frustrating. The max volume aspect of the tool works fine for me. If I set it to max the volume to -2.5db it does that with no problem. But if I set the threshold at -12 and the max volume at -2.5, then even noise at or approaching -Inf gets bumped up to -2.5. Do you know if SF 8 has this same problem?

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: rraud

Date:4/10/2006 10:40:51 AM

You may have the Auto gain compensate engaged in the first compressor stage.
Other than that, what you describe is normal operaton of any compressor or vol max. (hardware comps. included) When the threshold is lowered it also brings up the noise floor, ie: tape hiss, room tone, ect.

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: fafow

Date:4/10/2006 11:37:51 AM

So, if I set the threshold at -6, then the audio that is between -inf and -6 will be increased, and everything from -6 and 0 will stay the same volume level? I was thinking it was the other way around. That everything from -6 to 9 would be increased and everything below -6 would stay the same.

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: R0cky

Date:4/10/2006 12:52:46 PM

Sounds like he's looking for an expander. Can you set the "compression" negative to get expansion in this plugin? Along with a threshold above which the expansion is engaged?

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: jumbuk

Date:4/10/2006 8:44:55 PM

A compressor works like this. Audio below the threshold stays unchanged. Audio above the threshold is reduced (compressed) progressively according to the compression ratio you selected. The result is of course that the overall loudness is lower, so you increase the output gain (the "makeup gain") to boost the maximum signal up to the limit of your outputs. This is what creates the overall feeling that you have increased the volume of the recording.

One unwanted side-effect is of course that you thereby increase the noise floor. This is what is happening to you, and it is exactly what you would expect.

The solution is to put a downwards expander just before the compressor. You can use the Sony Graphic Dynamics for this - it has a preset called soft noise gate to get you started. In fact, you can use the graphic dynamics plug-in to do both your noise reduction and compression at the same time, rather than Wave Hammer.

I use the Waves C1 compressor plug-in, which combines all these tools in an easy to use interface.

PS A second unwanted side-effect of heavy compression is loss of high-frequency detail. You may need to add an exciter or a slight hi-freq EQ tilt after the compressor, depending on how hard you are squashing the audio.

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: fafow

Date:4/11/2006 1:37:07 PM

jumbuk, thanks for the reply. I'll check out the graphic dynamics for this. I may be beating a dead horse here, and forgive me if I am, but I was thinking that bypassing the compressor in the wave hammer and using JUST the volume maximiser would allow me to increase the volume of just the signal above a certain threshold. But, it seems from what I am reading here that this is not a workable solution. I do not do this for a living, but only a hobby and have been learning tons the last year or so. Thanks to all for their willingness to help. :-)

Subject:RE: wave hammer

Reply by: jumbuk

Date:4/12/2006 6:28:15 PM

The volume maximiser is just a limiter, which is a compressor with an infinite compression ratio. So it works exactly as I described earlier - it squashes everything above the threshold down to the threshold. It has an auto gain adjustment which then lifts everyhting up so that the maximum volume is brought back up to 0 db. So your noise is increased as well.

Trust me, this is a common problem, and the normal solution is to use a gate or an expander. I don't like gates, because the transition from signal to no signal is too abrupt, and ends up being more obvious than the noise. Fiddle with the graphic dynamics until you find something that works.