Subject:ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Posted by: B.C.

Date:3/15/2005 7:39:06 AM

Whenever I change projects I have no audio on playback.

I have to go into preferences -> audio and re-select the EMU ASIO driver and press "apply". Then playback resumes normally.

Kinda strange.

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: pwppch

Date:3/15/2005 8:53:12 AM

We are aware of issues with the EMU line of pro audio cards. (This was suppose to be documented in the readme for ACID 5.0a, but it appears to have been left out.)

The issues are caused by how the EMU ASIO drivers deal with sample rate and other changes that a host may request of the hardware. These issues are unique to the EMU drivers.

We are working on a solution. Your current work around is the only work around.

No, I can't say when this issue will be resolved and an update released.

Peter

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: Martian

Date:3/17/2005 11:44:33 AM

Hi there

I have the same thing... What i do to get on with this problem is to leave the patchmix open. Everytime I dont have sound I simply change program (click on patchmix window) and go back to acid. The sound is then back.

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: pwppch

Date:3/17/2005 4:53:45 PM

Yep, this solves this as well. A bit easier of a workaround.

Peter

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: B.C.

Date:3/21/2005 7:25:49 AM

Ahh - thanks for the tip. Much obliged.

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: B.C.

Date:3/22/2005 2:09:43 PM

FWIW - this solution doesn't work for me (clicking back in the PatchMix window).

I have to open the audio-properties dialog and re-select EMU-ASIO, click "apply", then my audio returns.

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: ctbarker32

Date:3/25/2005 9:09:09 PM

Frankly I can't get any work done with Sony software and Emu's ASIO. I have the Emulator X (1212m card). I can reliably crash Acid 5.0a using Emu's latest ASIO drivers. I emailed Emu months ago about this very issue in this thread and received one reply asking all sorts of questions. I dutifully replied to every one of their questions but also pointed out that they could easily download a demo of Sony Pictures software and test for themselves. Since then they have never replied or followed up. Or, for that matter, issued new drivers in like more than 6 months!

It is really frustrating to be a consumer of music hardware and software. The finger pointing that goes on between the software and hardware manufacturers is a real disservice to the customer. It's really frustrating. So for now I only use WDM with EMU and Sony Pictures software. Maybe things will get straightened out before I die?

Now if only someone at Sony could sort out the folks at IK Multimedia I'd be a really happy camper. Things seemed to have improved somewhat with the Acid 5.0a update but I'm still having lots of stuck notes problems with Sampletank.

-CB

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: pwppch

Date:3/26/2005 8:33:53 AM

We have in now way, shape, or form pointed any fingers at EMU and they - as far as I know - have not done this. We are in contact with EMU and they have been very, very helpful and responsive. We are giving EMU any support they need and they are providing us with any infromation we my need.

We know the cause of the problem, as I stated. We are working on a solution.

I understand your frustration. While unfortunate, the EMU issues were not presented to us until after we shipped. We test with as many devices and in as many scenarios as we can. We did not have EMU hardware, and we hontestly don't just obtain every new (or old) piece of hardware made.

We are working on a solution with our products and the EMU ASIO drivers. I cannot provide you with a time frame on the release of this solution.

Regards
Peter

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: ctbarker32

Date:3/26/2005 10:01:32 AM

Hi Peter,

Thanks for your response. Just to be clear, I did not specify Sony and Emu were pointing fingers at each other in this exact instance. I was being more generic when I said "hardware and software companies point fingers." I just wanted to illustrate how the customer is always caught in the middle with an endless round robin of no solutions to product interactions.

I am a loyal Sony/Sonic Foundry customer. I own all your products and am getting ready to upgrade to Sound Forge 8. I am definitely on your side and frankly feel that Emu is the one letting us down.

Having said this, I do take issue with the comment that you didn't know about this issue until after Acid 5 shipped. It was reported by users on this board with several Sony apps well before Acid 5 even RTM'd. Here is my original problem report I sent to Emu months ago. You will see it mentions Acid 4 and Vegas 5. I made an effort to contact Emu and received two responses asking rather general questions that I answered and then complete silence.

I am so happy that there is a dialog between your two companies. This bodes well for the customer. Maybe since you are on such good terms maybe you can ask them why it's been 6 months since I reported the problem to them and they have never responded since the initial contact and have not issued any new or beta drivers to try and resolve the problem? It seems that resolving this problem is in both company's interest? No? What is a reasonable time frame for a solution? 6 months? 1 year? Never? Sorry, I can't help being a bit sarcastic.

-CB


Subject: Re: EMU - Support Request Form (KMM4247325I24521L0KM)
From: EMU Support <EMU.Support@customercare.creative.com>
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 23:37:31 +0100 (BST)
To: Chris Barker

First,,,if you have not yet downloaded the newest drivers V1.60.. do
so here: http://www.emu.com/support/files/download2.asp?Centric=762&Platform=1
Does this fix the problem???


Regards;
E-MU Systems Inc.
Technical support
831-438-1921 xt.4

Original Message Follows:
------------------------
=======================

Subject: EMU - Support Request Form
Name: Chris Barker
E-mail Address:
Region: Americas
Self Description: Advanced PC User
--------------------------
Support Inquiry: I need support with an E-MU hardware product
Product: Emulator X
--------------------------
Operating System: Windows XP
Model Number: 1212m
Computer Type: Dell
CPU: Pent 4 2.8mhz
RAM: 1 gb
BIOS: Dell
Motherboard/Chipset: Intel 875
--------------------------
Detailed Problem Description:
Could someone explain the following behavior?

Open Vegas 5 and record some analog input to a new track. Using
latest drivers from E-MU and ASIO under Vegas 5. Records fine
and plays back fine. Save project. Close project. Open project.
Hit play and meters in Vegas show something is playing but there
is no output heard through 1212M. Stop playback. Click on
PatchMix app border that is also open on desktop (don't make any
changes, just make PatchMix the active app). Switch back to
Vegas and hit play and now sound is heard as expected. Similar
type of scenario also happens with Acid 4.

It appears that everytime I start a new project in Vegas/Acid I
have to restart the ASIO driver ? Why is this? What setting do I
have to change to eliminate this behavior?

Running WinXP Home, SP2, Nvidia Display drivers, System very stable.

Thanks.

-CB

=======================

Subject: Re: EMU - Support Request Form (KMM4253098I24521L0KM)
From: EMU Support <EMU.Support@customercare.creative.com>
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2004 18:01:34 +0100 (BST)
To: Chris Barker

Thanks for the info...i will forward this information to our testing
department to see if they can replicate the problem...

There are some basic steps that you can take to check if this
is a system-related problem:

1. Windows Related
· Make sure EMU ASIO is the currently-selected ASIO driver
· Increase EMU ASIO driver latency in ASIO control panel
· Temporarily disconnect from the network, if one is present
· Increase disk cache buffer settings
· Go to System/Properties/Advanced/Performance/Settings and setting to
"best performance"
· Temporarily disable virus and messaging software
· Defragment the hard drive

2. BIOS Related
· Go into the BIOS and set PCI Bus Latency to 64 (or higher if possible)
· Go into the BIOS and disable the motherboard's onboard sound
· Go into the BIOS and turn off Legacy USB -- (note that this will
prevent the use of USB mice and keyboards until Windows has booted)
· Check the motherboard manufacturer's website to see if there's an
update for the BIOS firmware if any other these features is not
available

3. Existing Hardware Related
· Remove other PCI cards temporarily to see if the problem goes away
· Set audio drive as IDE master with no other IDE device as a slave on
that IDE channel

If you insert a test-tone in Patchmix, can you then see a level
displayed on the screen? Is there any audio output from this?

Please also describe the exact specification of your Computer:
· Operating System + service pack:
· CPU brand, model, speed:
· Is HyperThreading on?
· Motherboard:
· Type and quantity of RAM:
· Graphics Card:
· HDs, including RPM and cache:
· Other PCI cards:
· Overclocked system?
· Wi-fi add-ons on Mobo?
· Audio Drive set as IDE Master?
· FS bus speed?
· DVD burner (on different IDE bus from audio drive?)

THIRD PARTY INFORMATION:
· Name and version # of applications(s):
· Current version?
· Cracked or official version?
· Is the app set to use ASIO, WDM, or MME?
· Does the app work successfully with other audio hardware? If so which
and in
what mode (ASIO, WDM, etc.)?

The normal steps once you have no other PCI devices in the system to
correct this problem would be as follows (you should stop at the stage
that corrects your problem):

1 - Reboot
2 - Restore Defaults from the Patchmix Menu and reboot.
3 - Uninstall the software, reboot, then reinstall software, and reboot again.
4 - Uninstall the Hardware and Software, then reboot, reinstall the
Hardware (in a different PCI slot) and Software.
5 - Fresh installation of Windows, followed by installing the hardware
and the software.

If you have proceeded through all of these steps, please let me know
which step is required to correct this problem.


Original Message Follows:
------------------------
I'm running all your latest drivers including the ones you reference.
What now?

Do you know you can download a free trial copy of Vegas from Sony? Why
not test my scenario for yourself and see if I'm not correct in pointing out
a problem with your ASIO drivers? Your WDM drivers work fine. It's the
ASIO driver that's giving me fits with Sony/Sonic Foundry products. Others on
the Sonic Foundry forums are reporting similar problems.

PatchMix DSP Version: 1.60.00
Driver Version: 5.12.01.0496
E-MU 1010 Firmware Version: 3.4
File Version: 1.60.01.0009
Build Date: Aug 19 2004 10:33:47

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: pwppch

Date:3/26/2005 6:01:17 PM

I will ask our customer support group to see if they have any reports with our products and EMU hardware/drivers. Did you report the problem through our customer or tech support?

I can only tell you what I know. I became aware of the issues in the late Dec 2004 early Jan 2005 time frame. I placed a request for hardware at that time. The hardware arrived in late Feburary. I did my intial testing and identified the issues early March. I then began respond on these forums that we were aware of the problems. EMU contacted me directly in mid March timeframe.

I can not speak for EMU in any way. Sorry.

I am working on the problem. The issues will be resolved through our work or through interaction with EMU and thier engineers. I can't say when an update will be released that will address this specific issue.

Regards,
Peter

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: ctbarker32

Date:3/30/2005 4:34:05 PM

Thanks Peter.

I now feel I've gotten both companies attention. I truly appreciate your efforts and believe a solution will be forthcoming at a future date. I just received an email with EMU's side of the story. It pretty much confirms your comments. It is interesting that they feel they are conforming to the letter of the ASIO spec but it does allow that maybe they need to bend a little to get along in the real world?

Just a brief aside. Peter, I was wondering if you would be willing to comment on state of ASIO development on a Hardware and Software side. You don't have to cite specific companies, just general experience. As someone that is obviously on the front lines I think we could all benefit from your observations on the maturity of ASIO development. IMHO, I feel we are wtih ASIO hardware/software about where we were 10 years ago with video drivers. In the earlier days of Windows, video drivers could make a tremendous impact on the stability of Windows. Today, I cannot recall anytime in recent memory where video drivers have made serious impacts to my Windows setup. They just seem to work.

Do you think we can reach such a level of stability with ASIO in hardware/software. My experience is we are not there yet. Your observations would be valuable.

Thanks.

-CB

Subject:
Re: EMU - Support Request Form (KMM5764211I24521L0KM)
From: EMU Support <EMU.Support@customercare.creative.com>
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 23:06:54 +0100 (BST)
To: Chris Barker

Dear Valued E-MU Customer;

Yes we are aware of this issue.
We have been working with Sony for a while but our previous contact is
no longer at Sony, there was a transition period, and we have recently
re-engaged. E-MU and Sony understand the issues and are working to fix
them as quickly as possible.

You should also know that E-MU products conform completely to the ASIO 2
spec. It is with products outside the spec that problems like this can
occur. This may be the case here. Nonetheless we recognize the
importance of solving this problem even if it means softening our ASIO 2
adherence.


** Please retain all previous correspondence when replying to this
email.

Regards;

E-MU Systems Inc.
Advanced Technical Support Group
www.emu.com


Original Message Follows:
------------------------
=======================

Subject: EMU - Support Request Form
Name: Chris Barker
E-mail Address:
Region: Americas
Self Description: Advanced PC User
--------------------------
Support Inquiry: I need support with a E-MU software application
Product: Emulator X
--------------------------
Operating System: Windows XP
Model Number: 400sc
Computer Type: Dell
CPU: 2.8ghz
RAM: 1 gb
BIOS: latest
Motherboard/Chipset: Intel 875
--------------------------
Detailed Problem Description:
Could someone tell me why I have never received any resolution
to EMU support request number: (KMM4253098I24521L0KM)? It has
been 6 months since I reported this issue.

In relation to this issue, could someone at Emu please, please,
read the forum thread at Sony Media Software that discusses this
support request and interaction betwen Emu ASIO drivers and Sony
Media software? How is a customer of both companies supposed to
resolve this issue? Sony says they actively talking to Emu. Is
anyone at Emu working on this?

You can find the thread at the following address:

http://tinyurl.com/5dfmx

Thank you.

-CB

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: kcrosley

Date:4/6/2005 2:51:06 PM

I've suffered from these same problems using Emulator X with Acid 5 and I'm glad to hear that they will potentially be resolved soon. I love both programs!

BTW, I have some free soundbanks for Emulator X users on my website at:

http://www.emulatorxone.com

Would love to hear from anyone who discovers any workarounds that help E-mu Emulator X work more reliably with Acid 5. One thing I've been thinking of trying is to run Emulator X in standalone mode and connect Acid to Emulator X via a "virtual midi cable" like Hubi's Loopback or MIDI-OX. But then, some of these conflicts seem to have to do with the audio driver as much as the Emulator X VST itself so I'm guessing that will be of limited help.

Best Regards,
Keith

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: stephenvv

Date:4/24/2005 1:26:45 PM

Bump:

Anyone of heard of when the fix for Emu/Acid is due? I would love to be able get my Emulator X working with Acid 5.

thanks
stephen

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: pwppch

Date:4/24/2005 6:18:32 PM

stephen:

The EMU driver issues have no relationship to using the Emulator X VSTi. I have tested the EmulatorX with ACID 4 and the latest release of ACID 5 and it works as expected.

Can you provide me with the details of the problems with the EmulatorX VSTi that you are having?

Peter

Subject:RE: ACID 5.0a and the EMU 1820M

Reply by: dirtynbl

Date:7/26/2006 5:37:46 PM

has acid pro 6 resolved any of these problems with the EMU 1820?