Subject:Multitracking, would it be hard?

Posted by: flow

Date:2/15/2005 4:22:35 AM

Hi all,
it seems most people here thinks adding mutitracking abilities to acid is a priority, but sony isn't listening or so it seems. i hope they're holding silence to come out with a big surprise next time, but then again who konws. I wonder: from a strictly technical point, is that hard to add m/t abilities to acid? I suppose it would be just a matter of cutting the relevant code from vegas, adapt a little to acid, paste it and not much more... am i wrong?
So maybe some expert coder could produce a hacked version of acid, if sony does not make the move... (joking! ..well...it would be fun! ) ;)

Subject:RE: Multitracking, would it be hard?

Reply by: JohnnyRoy

Date:2/15/2005 6:59:05 AM

> it seems most people here thinks adding mutitracking abilities to acid is a priority, but sony isn't listening or so it seems

I don’t think it’s a technical issue. I believe it’s a problem in the direction of ACID as a product. If you add multi-track to ACID then what about Vegas? Isn’t that the multi-tracker which now supports ACID loops? Why not just add MIDI to Vegas and make that the audio app? It’s a strange dilemma because it’s a strange product line. Three musical products (Sound Forge, ACID, & Vegas) and not a complete package between them. (i.e., with a MIDI Sequencer, etc. to complete with ProTools, SONAR, Cubase, Logic).

It seems these programs have an identity crisis. They’re not quite sure who they are:

Psychiatrist: So what is you problem?
ACID: I don’t know who I am. My friends want me to be a MIDI Sequencer but my father said I’m not allowed.
Vegas: I’m an NLE, no I’m a DAW, NO, No, no, I’m an NLE... but maybe I’m a DAW?
Sound Forge: See what a dysfunctional family I come from?

But seriously, it’s not clear to any of us what Sony’s strategy is and I made a post a while ago asking for clarification. I got nothing in reply. I personally don’t need multi-track recording because I’m a solo musician and if I need to record multi-track I can always use Vegas.

There are two ways to change the product line that make sense to me:

1) Add the Vegas audio capabilities to ACID along with MIDI Sequencing and make a complete DAW out of ACID. Then Vegas could be the NLE (albeit with great audio).

2) Add MIDI Sequencing and ReWire to Vegas to allow ACID to plug-in as a ReWrire device.

It seems to me it would be easier to add multi-track, punch in/out, and better MIDI Sequencing to ACID than it would to add VSTi etc. to Vegas. Maybe they will add ReWire to Vegas so at a minimum, you could record multi-track audio with Vegas while syncing to loops in ACID. That sounds like the easiest plan to me. It still doesn’t help me recording MIDI with punch-in/out but it’s a start.

~jr

Subject:RE: Multitracking, would it be hard?

Reply by: flow

Date:2/15/2005 7:12:23 AM

Yes JohnnyRoy it would be at least an usable solution... I was thinking they could add a "save as acid project" to vegas to avoid having two apps loaded at the same time and thus writing the meta information we need. Acid coul be used later in another work session. I'm sure vegas is already capable to export acd session files, but the option just is not there.

Subject:RE: Multitracking, would it be hard?

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:2/15/2005 5:15:25 PM

I've been asking for the ability of Acid to be rendered as a Vegas project or for Vegas to have the ability to open an Acid project, but no bite so far.

JR, I have scanario 3:

3) Develop a midi sequencing app with rewire capability and add rewire Host to Vegas. This way the midi sequencer app can be well focused and be a stand alone app for those of us doing strictly midi sequencing or it could be rewired into Acid or Vegas.

My thought on this is that some users want midi sequencing in Vegas, others want it in Acid. So why develop midi sequencing in 2 seperate apps, just make a seperate midi sequencer and you can have it the same in both apps. "Midi Forge", bring it on!!!!

It's basically what I was saying though, just fill in the holes, any of these scenarios would work.....but of course I like mine best. :-)

Subject:RE: Multitracking, would it be hard?

Reply by: MyST

Date:2/15/2005 5:46:05 PM

Scenario 3... I LIKE!

So, that's 2 votes for 3.

Mario

PS: The name MIDI Forge... awesome!

Subject:RE: Multitracking, would it be hard?

Reply by: Zacchino

Date:2/15/2005 10:15:59 PM

Hey hey hey stop this !

I agree that scenario 3 is good but... Composer's time coasting. How many files to save for a song then ? One for Acid, one for the midi sequencing prog and one or more for the other rewired (i.e. Reason, Gigastudio) devices ... rewired to what btw ? The Midi Sequencing Prog or Acid ? And all this rewired to Vegas for Audio Multitracking ? Wow.

That's way too much when we know that Acid5"s midi sequencer is great but just lacking of some important features :
-Arpegiator as an OPT Midi plugin for example
- On-the-fly midi file quick editing (that only alows moving and resizing of events) in the main sequencer windows.
-A less buggy and DEDICATED (internal) History. Linked to "Undo CTRL+Z"; and "Redo CTRL+Y" keyboard shorcut while current midi track's properties is the active window/tab selected.

No. to respond to the original poster, I think multitracking would be a pain in the *ss for Acid devellopers. It's too much for them (seriously, not joking). Multitracking means automation curves recording and playback for every VSTi (with improved automation curves' copy/pasting, as in ProTools). Plus the work to implementing Vega's Multitracking technology... That's too much for them in my point of view. Compared to the work done / time spent between AP4 and AP5. Assuming they've only been working on Acid (and not on Vegas, SF update AND Acid at the same time).

That's why I think Sony hasn't took Sonic Foundry's Acid project seriously. If they had, with a brand name like Sony, they would have hired more programmers, engineers, devellopers or whatever to boost Acid to this PT/Logic/Cubase/Sonar competition level.