Subject:Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Posted by: CDM

Date:1/20/2005 6:43:04 AM

http://mediasoftware.sonypictures.com/news/ShowRelease.asp?ReleaseID=592

Sound Forge 8 software's many new powerful features and enhancements include:

* Application scripting
* Batch converter functionality
* Includes CD Architect 5.2 software for professional CD mastering
* Direct file export to CD Architect software
* VST effect support
* ASIO driver support
* Customizable keyboard mapping
* Audio scrubbing
* Windows XP theme support

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: mpd

Date:1/20/2005 7:51:40 AM

I really hope this is true, and they are realistic about the release date. Scripting and batch processing will make my life a lot easier, and so will scrubbing.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: kbruff

Date:1/20/2005 8:42:54 AM

AWESOME ---

Application scripting
Batch converter functionality
Includes CD Architect 5.2 software for professional CD mastering
Direct file export to CD Architect software
VST effect support
ASIO driver support


!!!!! THANK YOU SO MUCH !!!!!!

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Lazarus

Date:1/20/2005 11:19:31 AM

Less of an impact when you already have CD Architect...

And seeing that SF is slowly turning into Wavelab, I just hope that
the ability to edit more than a single stereo track at once comes
sooner rather than later - I've hordes of 4 track tapes from
my old portastudio I'll only feel comfortable editing in SoundForge.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Chienworks

Date:1/20/2005 11:52:31 AM

Lazarus: why doesn't editing them in Vegas make you feel comfortable?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: rraud

Date:1/20/2005 12:13:47 PM

I guess we'll have to wait and see if the CDArc supports CD-Text. But I can live without it.
yeah... VST support,
made my day, thanks for the info

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Nat

Date:1/20/2005 12:31:34 PM

"I guess we'll have to wait and see if the CDArc supports CD-Text."

It does...

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: bnjenter

Date:1/20/2005 5:59:43 PM

It sounds like the Sony crew has done an awesome job. I'm thrilled with the new features and, my only concern is that the upgrade price will continue to be bearable (I'm now at that fixed income stage of life). Sony is listening to our needs – That's Fabulous
Bob

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: musicvid10

Date:1/20/2005 7:41:09 PM

Scrubbing!
A transcriber's dream!
THX

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:1/20/2005 8:18:14 PM

The Complete Published List:
New! VST plug-in effect support
New! Includes CD Architect 5.2 with CD Text support
New! Direct file export to CD Architect software
New! Application scripting
New! Script editor window
New! Batch converter functionality
New! Audio scrubbing tool
New! JKL keyboard commands for scrub
New! Customizable keyboard mapping
New! Windows XP theme support
New! Save paths in rendered media
New! ASIO™ driver support
New! Updated Regions List and Playlist windows
New! Real-time editing of fields
New! List sorting
New! Flash (.swf) format import
New! Additional HD video options


ahhhhhhhhhhhh......CDtext support. I thought I would never see the day. Now if only Vegas 6 will follow the lead, I will truly be a happy camper.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: zendar

Date:1/21/2005 9:44:10 AM

superb. all it needs is the aforementioned simple multitracking facility (even 2 stereo tracks will do it) as vegas just aint the same environment no matter what everyone tells me. i love vegas and acid also, but when its time to edit, i get mey sound forge head on and thats that!

but a really great update. it could be argued all they are doing is catching up, but i'd rather wait and use the new features in sf than have em early in the godawful shitlab

looks like sony are doing the sonic foundry legacy justice, excellent.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: CDM

Date:1/21/2005 10:11:44 AM

just out of curiosity - how can you edit more easily in Sound Forge than you can in Vegas? Other than pencil drawing, what can't you do editing-wise in Vegas that you can do in Sound Forge. I can think of many more things you can do in Vegas (for editing) than you can in Sound Forge. For restoration, processing and mastering, Sound Forge is it, for sure.

I'm just curious. It's probably just getting used to a certain workflow

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: zendar

Date:1/21/2005 12:39:48 PM

it's a subtle combination of psychological headspace and keyboard shortcut familiarity that i can't even properly explain in a left brain way...i have a soft spot for the forge...it takes me back to my first computer editing experiences, how i laughed and cried at the same time when i realised that prior to this i had been attempting to wallpaper the hallway through the letterbox...

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Lazarus

Date:1/21/2005 1:49:07 PM

'Chienworks' wrote:
> Lazarus: why doesn't editing them in Vegas make you feel comfortable?

Well, if I had half a grand to buy Vegas, I'm sure it would be
comfortable but certainly overkill just for this audio only feature
- a feature that Wavelab has had for years and one that I'd have
hoped SoundForge would have had by now...

It would be cheaper to buy Wavelab. After living & breathing
SoundForge for years, however, I find Wavelab totally unfathomable
and unintuitive.

Would multitrack audio editing be so out of place in SoundForge?

I just want to be able to do what I do presently on a recording from a
stereo/mono input but on a recording from four inputs - is this so
unheard of?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:1/21/2005 2:15:53 PM

"- a feature that Wavelab has had for years and one that I'd have
hoped SoundForge would have had by now...?"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but to do the type of editing that I'm thinking that you're thinking of in Wavelab, don't you have to use the CD Montage Window? I hear what you guys are saying and I fully agree with you, that it would be nice if Sound Forge had a simple type of dual stereo track wave editor window, where you could slip audio around etc on seperate tracks. BUT!!!! This is what CD Architect does and CD Architect is included with Sound Forge. So eccentially you're getting what you're asking for. In CD Architect it has a button, where you can enable "Use Second Audio Layer". Well this is exactly what Zendar is descibing. Including CD Architect with Sound Forge, is giving a lot of what we're looking for. Compare the combination of Sound Forge and CDA, with Wavecrap and it's audio montage Window, then the Sound Forge 8.0 bundle beats it hands down.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: andy01

Date:1/22/2005 2:24:08 AM

If I purchase Sound Forge 7.0 now, will I get a free upgrade to SF 8?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: MyST

Date:1/22/2005 4:51:09 AM

Best bet to contact customer service directly with that question.

Mario

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:1/22/2005 8:12:33 AM

"If I purchase Sound Forge 7.0 now, will I get a free upgrade to SF 8?"

Of course you will and you also get a free copy of Acid Pro 5.0, Sony Noise reduction. OOh, and Sony's also throwing in a free video camera with a Sony Vaio Laptop. Just as long as you buy Sound Forge 7.0 now....so don't wait.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: kbruff

Date:1/22/2005 10:22:42 AM

I cant wait to see what scripting will allow us to do...

Furthermore the new...

Scrubbing tools

Is there a pre-buy program, I would like to support SSF, ASAP?

Thanks,
Kevin
******

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Lazarus

Date:1/22/2005 10:56:49 AM

Rednroll wrote:
> ..you're getting what you're asking for...In CD Architect..

I've not used it a lot yet but I've already got CD Architect (5.0a)
and I'm damned if I can find a record button on it. Or anywhere to
set up four or more audio inputs. And maybe I'm dumb & blind but I
get the distinct impression that CD Architect won't allow me to edit
a multitrack recording of four or more _mono_ files. There are none
of the ancillary analysis tools that SF has either. I could go on but it
is, after all, a CD mastering package so hardly surprising - if it could
do everything SoundForge did, there would be no need for the 'Open
In Sound Forge' menu entry. Or SoundForge itself.

And like 'zendar' said about Vegas, it is not the same as editing in
Sound Forge. I can't get anywhere near down to the same level of
detailed manipulation and I miss all my little monitoring windows.
Opening up a MIDI/audio sequencer, again, is just to clunky compared
to SF. I can take apart, reverse, spot-process etc., almost in my sleep
with SoundForge - that's what it's supremely good at. The best even.

You're right, however, if you mean one could record a multitrack
consisting of just two stereo tracks in another application, import
them into CD Architect, line them up and restricted oneself to the
basics... but that's about it.

I guess it's the grey, no-man's land between audio editor and
multi-track sequencer I'm talking about.

All I'm asking for is this "Use Second Audio Layer" (plus a third,
fourth etc.,) option but in SoundForge - so I can record, if needs
be, from up to all eight inputs from my soundcard and the
ability to edit the result with the same finesse that I presently
can in SF with a single stereo file. Is this so huge an increase in
technology that I have to fork out all over again to buy Vegas
when I've absolutely no need for a video-editing program?
However, if you can show me how to do this in CD Architect...

On the other hand, I'm only 'assuming' this is what can be done in
Wavelab (with the 'Audio Montage' stuff). Maybe there are
debilitating restrictions there too, I dunno - the demos of the
bloody thing that I've tried down the years have been so
infuriating that one's thoughts turn to an alternative career in
accountancy rather than trying to make sense of any of it, but
if it has:

"Sample accurate..Multi-channel surround audio support from
input to output with up to eight audio channels for recording,
editing, processing and mastering..Multi-channel metering and
analysis with up to eight channels..."

- then I want it done properly in SF! I even don't mind paying extra
for, say, a Sound Forge 'Platinum'. It would seem that all this and
more is already scattered around several Sony apps, surely it
wouldn't be a quantum leap to consolidate some of it under the
hood of SoundForge? If not in SoundForge, where else? Lordy,
this is 'Sony' after all - didn't we all console ourselves once that
the Sonic Foundry team would henceforth be liberated to do
anything they wanted with their new found billion$ ?? ;-)

OK, it might be that, pre-ASIO, this has simply been impossible.
Maybe it's just around the corner. I hope so.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:1/23/2005 7:17:17 PM

Lazarus,
Now that you've further explained what you're looking for, then NO Sound Forge does not offer this. And yes, this was actually simular to one of my feature suggestions for doing multi-channel mastering tasks.....not so much for editing each track or recording multiple tracks at the same time. It's more for being able to perform processing on multiple tracks for mastering surround mixes, as is how it's done in Wavelab also. For what you're asking, Vegas suits those tasks very well. Vegas is not strictly a Video editor. It was first a multitrack audio editor, before any video editing features where added. So to a lot of us audio users, Vegas is first and foremost a multitrack audio editor. Sound Forge is a stereo editor. What you're asking for is a task that Vegas was designed for and Sound Forge was originally not. Vegas is best suited for the tasks you're asking for, and I'm not sure why you're having a hard time getting your head around this functionality in Vegas aside for paying the extra money that Vegas was designed to accomplish. The best things about the Sony line of products is that each program is specialized in handling certain tasks. I'm sure Sony could add multitracking features into Sound Forge, then that might take away from the simplified UI, that we all know and love, so there's some trade-offs to consider. I'm happy with Sound Forge not being able to record and edit multiple tracks at a time, because that's what I have Vegas for.

See feature suggestion posts here:
http://mediasoftware.sonypictures.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?MessageID=328394&Replies=102&Page=1

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: ibliss

Date:1/24/2005 6:11:00 AM

It just seems slightly odd that a company that has more than just it's toes dipped in the world of video that multichannel wavs are not supprted. Hey Ho.

Didn't go from 6>7... might go from 6>8 depending on price.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Lazarus

Date:1/24/2005 7:26:18 AM

Rednroll wrote:
> Now that you've further explained what you're looking for ...
> this was actually simular [sic] to one of my feature suggestions
> for doing multi-channel mastering tasks.....not so much for
> editing each track or recording multiple tracks at the same time.
> It's more for being able to perform processing on multiple tracks
> for mastering surround mixes ..

No, "editing each track or recording multiple tracks at the
same time" is precisely what I'm asking for (and as I described
before). I quoted the Wavelab features only to highlight what has
existed already for some time in that application. I'm not asking for
_everything_ Wavelab does. I don't even care about the 'surround'
aspect though I'm sure it would benefit some.

And given that, in the forum link you provided, you yourself
suggested "Multi channel Wave support" (as did several others)
I fail then to see why my asking for such a feature is not a
valid request. We differ only on priorities in any such
implementation.

> For what you're asking, Vegas suits those tasks very well.

Well, I've downloaded a demo of it and can now heartily concur
with 'zendar' - it is not the same beast at all. But I've had
little time with it so maybe you can tell me how I can manipulate
files at single sample resolution and where I might find Auto
Region/Extract Regions, Spectrum/Sonogram analysis, the Pencil
Tool/Waveform drawing, Acid Looping Tools, Loop Tuner, Edit Acid
Properties, Repair, Playlist/Cutlist etc., etc.,

And a lot of chores in Vegas seem to demand a different work style
and much more in mouse clicks and navigation of windows than
equivalent routines in Sound Forge. Again: if Vegas could do
everything Sound Forge does, there would be no need for the 'Open
In Sound Forge' menu entry. Or Sound Forge itself.

> Vegas is not strictly a Video editor. It was first a multitrack
> audio editor, before any video editing features where added. So to
> a lot of us audio users, Vegas is first and foremost a multitrack
> audio editor. Sound Forge is a stereo editor. What you're asking
> for is a task that Vegas was designed for and Sound Forge was
> originally not.

Nostalgia vs. development!! I doubt if iTunes and eBay were what
the US military had in mind when the Internet was originally
designed. Wavelab too (years ago) was just a "stereo editor"
neither does it demand ownership of 'Nuendo' for anything other
than mono/stereo files.

> I'm not sure why you're having a hard time getting your head
> around this functionality in Vegas aside for paying the extra
> money

Possibly for the same reasons as your not "getting your head
around this" when you also asked for "Multi channel Wave support".
Plus the functionality to which I'm referring does not apparently
fully reside in Vegas _alone_ either.

On Sony's product page:
"Vegas® 5 software is an all-in-one professional solution
for editing video and audio on the PC platform...It is
perfect for A/V production.."

Half of it - the 'V' in A/V - is superfluous to my needs and,
naturally, accounts for why it is way more expensive than Sound
Forge. Besides, along with the hastened onset of Repetitive Strain
Injury, it seems that to do what I want I'd have to own both Vegas
_and_ Sound Forge anyway!

> ..each [Sony] program is specialized in handling certain tasks..

What I have requested falls perfectly within the remit of Sound
Forge's specialization:
"The industry standard in digital audio editing is our
full-featured Sound Forge audio editor — designed with the
audio professional in mind.."
Even a trivial assessment of the features I am describing would
hardly categorize them outside that overview.

Adobe's Audition apparently also has a multi-channel capability:
"recording, mixing, and editing up to 128 stereo tracks. Record
up to 32 inputs.."
Likewise, once also just a "stereo editor", it too boasts of being
a "professional audio editing environment that offers advanced
audio mixing, editing, and effects-processing capabilities.."
and does not require one to off load multi-track duties to
'Premiere'. Thus, out of the big pro audio-specific PC editors, Sound
Forge stands alone in lacking multi-channel audio support.

> I'm sure Sony could add multitracking features into Sound Forge,
> then that might take away from the simplified UI, that we all know
> and love ..

It might. It need not, however. The wealth of features already in
Sound Forge are masterfully arranged - the beauty of SF is that one
can customize it to be as simple or as complex as one likes. I
doubt if the developers would suddenly lose the plot in this regard.

> I'm happy with Sound Forge not being able to record and edit
> multiple tracks at a time, because that's what I have Vegas for.

I daresay your requirements are not universal, however. For a
comprehensive editing solution in the area I have outlined, others
are unhappy that they seemingly have only the option of buying both
Sound Forge and Vegas for a clunky approximation of this
functionality or turning to the competition for a single product at
half the price.

Anyway, we will just have to agree to differ. It is, after all, only
a question of choice. I'm sure it's been on the 'To Do' list for
a while - possibly only architectural commitments and/or
budget concerns early in Sound Forge's development cycle have
prevented it being implemented sooner rather than later - absence
of features is not evidence for absence of intent.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:1/24/2005 1:51:54 PM

Wow, you sure did go on for awhile about how our viewpoints differ, where on the most part I agreed with what you're asking for and was in my feature request as I pointed out. You mention other apps and their features and compare them to what Sound Forge offers. Have you ever used Adobe Audition? I have....actually I have Cool Edit Pro 2.0 It's basically a multitrack program, with a seperate Stereo editor. It's basically the same functionality of having Sound Forge and Vegas, but I can probably go on for days about what Audition doesn't have also, compared to having a Vegas and Sound Forge combo. Actually, from what I see it doesn't have surround mixing capabilities, but if you can point me to a feature list on the Adobe site, where it says it has at least 5.1 mixing capabilities or tell me how to do it, I will be greatly appreciative. As far as Wavelab is concerned they just offered multichannel support in v5.0. From what I see on their website the price for Wavelab is $700. Compare that to Sound Forge's price of $400. So I guess you're paying a lot more for that multichannel support now aren't you? Ok, now Sound Forge plus Vegas if purchased seperately would cost you $400 + $560= $960.....not much more than Wavelab, for a ton more features. Now to equal that combination of features of Forge/Vegas, let's put Wavelab and Nuendo together at $700+$1300. Hmmmm! $2000!!!!!

So with the same point you bring up, of "I daresay your requirements are not universal, however." Yours are not either. There are users that don't require all the multiwave surround features.....then why should they pay the extra $300 if they don't need these features as you have to in Wavelab? Would you pay the $700 price tag for Sound Forge if it had all of Wavelab's features? I would bet that the majority of users would rather have the choice of paying $400 for Sound Forge and if they needed the surround support look into purching Vegas for the extra $560, or shop around for a packaged deal, which Sony has offered in the past of a Vegas/Forge combo. So while you're saying you get more features at half the price, I'm not seeing it. I actually see it the opposite, where you're paying double for a Wavelab/Nuendo combination compared to a Sound Forge/Vegas combination and on top of that, you can do professional video editing at a price $1000 less.

I think before you go on your little rampage, you need to do some more indept feature comparisons of what Wavelab has, compared to Sound Forge, especially for the $300 higher price tag. Then look at the price on Vegas and compare that to Nuendo. Then go and look at Adobe Auditions features and user interface, and compare that to Vegas, and then you basically get what you pay for. An editor that does a whole lot of everything, but does a whole lot of nothing very well.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: busterkeaton

Date:1/24/2005 4:50:46 PM

You probably will.
Before you do, you will want to find what the cutoff date is. You are usually eligible for an free upgrade if you buy the previous version 2 months or a month before the next one comes out.

I bought Vegas 3 after Vegas 4 was announced and I got a free upgrade. I think it was a two month window. (The awesome thing was I got Vegas 3 at a discounted price. You may be able to find retailers who want to clear out their stock of SF7.) They were still Sonic Foundry then, I don't know if Sony changed things.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rob_D

Date:1/25/2005 3:53:35 AM

Quote: They were still Sonic Foundry then, I don't know if Sony changed things.

Sorry, but it was Sony who released SF 7

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Soundshepherd

Date:1/25/2005 6:32:48 AM

Wow, costumizable keyboard shortcuts. Only 7 years late!

But yeah, that's one sweet list. Now to see if the script/batch system is as powerful as Cool Edits.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:1/25/2005 9:28:06 AM

"Sorry, but it was Sony who released SF 7"

Yes, but I believe he was referring to the purchase of Vegas 3, when ge got a free upgrade to Vegas 4, which was still Sonic Foundry for those versions.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: busterkeaton

Date:1/25/2005 3:27:29 PM

Yes, when I got my free upgrade from Vegas 3 to Vegas 4, Sony had not yet purchased Sonic Foundry.

As far as I have seen Sony has kept Sonic Foundry's policies in regards of licensing and upgrades, but don't quote me on it.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: ClipMan

Date:1/25/2005 5:59:35 PM

...the Windows Theme Support is worth the price of the upgrade alone ... rock solid audio editor getting even better .... going on my list ...

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: BrianStanding

Date:1/26/2005 8:55:25 AM

"Half of it - the 'V' in A/V - is superfluous to my needs and,
naturally, accounts for why it is way more expensive than Sound
Forge. Besides, along with the hastened onset of Repetitive Strain
Injury, it seems that to do what I want I'd have to own both Vegas
_and_ Sound Forge anyway!"

If you're only doing a couple of tracks, Vegas Movie Studio might just fill the bill, at a fraction of the cost. Otherwise, you could use Acid, which would give you basic mult-tracking along with all the music creation stuff that is unique to Acid.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: tjburton

Date:1/26/2005 9:30:43 AM

Speaking of upgrades... any guesses or anyone heard what the upgrade cost will be?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:1/26/2005 11:07:45 AM

" it seems that to do what I want I'd have to own both Vegas
_and_ Sound Forge anyway!"

Welcome to the world we live in. I believe anyone no matter what they're doing, they use multiple programs. I have Vegas, Sound Forge, CD Architecture, Acid, Noise Reduction plugin, Studio Vision, Nero, Disc Welder Platinum, along with 100 DX plugins from various other Vendors as well as Adobe Photoshop, and Illustrator, all to do one task. Audio Production. It's like a toolbox. If a carpenter needs a specific tool to do a specialized task, then they buy that tool and add it to their toolbox. Should I complain to Snap-ON and Craftman, because I can't use their hammer to tighten bolts? I bet if I tried hard enough, I could actually tighten bolts with a hammer, but it's just not the right tool to do what I want. It's the same way in the Software world.

Sure there's other options. So this is your responsibility to shop around and look at what's available and then decide what works for you best to meet your workflow and budget. Don't expect to buy a swiss army knife and expect to be able to do brain surgery. Sure you could do brain surgery with a swiss army knife, but I'm sure people paying you money to do the surgery would prefer to go to someone else, who went out and purchased the specialized tools to perform that task and I'm sure they paid quite a bit more money for those specialized tools than you did for your swiss army knife. Also, as a smart shopper you shouldn't expect to buy a hammer today, and expect it to transform into an all-in-one tool that does everything, just because your needs change in the future. If Adobe Audition does everything you want and fits your budget, then buy Audition. If Wavelab does everything you want and fits your budget also, then buy Wavelab. Obviously, you purchased Sound Forge because it did what you wanted and fit your budget at that time. Now your workflow needs have increased. Doesn't Sound Forge still do what you originally purchased it for?

Really though, isn't this just common sense?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Lazarus

Date:1/26/2005 11:59:25 PM

BrianStanding wrote:
> .. you could use Acid, which would give you basic multi-tracking
> along with all the music creations stuff that is unique to Acid.

Many thanks. At your prompt, I've just investigated this. Yes, if only for playback (with Beat
Mapper off) and in tandem with Sound Forge, Acid is a more realistic workaround for now.

Cheers

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Lazarus

Date:1/27/2005 12:09:35 AM

Rednroll wrote:
> Wow, you sure did go on for awhile about how our viewpoints differ..

Yet, sadly, still to no avail because - wow - you sure keep wilfully missing the point.

> You mention other apps and their features and compare them to what
> Sound Forge offers. Have you ever used Adobe Audition?...

Yes, and bloody WaveLav too - irrelevant! The comparisons I drew were regarding multi-channel
support alone. Your 'With Us Or Against Us' bible thumping is preaching to the converted. If I
preferred those apps, I obviously wouldn't be here defending the validity of what I and many
others would like to see in Sound Forge.

> .. I can probably go on for days ..

You already have.

> but if you can point me to a feature list on the Adobe site, where it says it has
> at least 5.1 mixing capabilities or tell me how to do it, I will be greatly appreciative.

And if you can point me to where I requested 5.1 mixing capabilities, I'm the Pope.

> As far as Wavelab is concerned they just offered multichannel support in v5.0

'Audio Montage' (multiple audio file editing) was introduced five years ago in Wavelab 3.

> Sound Forge plus Vegas if purchased seperately would cost you $400 +
> $560= $960.....not much more than Wavelab, for a ton more features.

For a ton more superfluous video oriented capabilities and an extra app for a feature that,
uncannily, it has occurred to both Steinberg and Adobe to include in one single audio editor.

> There are users that don't require all the multiwave surround features..

So what? There are users that don't require CD burning either. As demonstrated, there are
those who would embrace multi-channel support. Even as an optional add-on, I suspect.
Skilfully executed, such a facility might tempt over users from other apps also.

> you need to do some more indept [sic] feature comparisons of what Wavelab has ..

Unnecessary, my previous overview suffices. You, however, need to accept that people are
not siding with the insurgency for having the temerity to desire a feature existing in other
audio editors and long requested for in Sound Forge by both amateur and professional alike.

> Don't expect to buy a swiss army knife and expect to be able to do brain surgery

Refining your metaphor, Sound Forge is rather a scalpel. Multi-channel support extends its reach.
This is not heresy. Sony will not invoke the Patriot Act if we look forward to future enhancements.

> If Adobe Audition does everything you want [..] then buy Audition. If Wavelab does
> everything you want [..] then buy Wavelab [..] Doesn't Sound Forge still do what you
> originally purchased it for? Really though, isn't this just common sense?

Really though, isn't that just irrelevant? And apologies owed to those who discussed previously
unrealized Sound Forge features: CD compilation, VST, ASIO support..? Ooh, look! Those
features are now with Sound Forge 8. Unhappily, too late - those users who dared asked for
more were all burned at the stake.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:1/27/2005 12:25:34 PM

I don't know who you're preaching too? I asked for the same feature in SF8.0 that you're complaining about it not having. Where were you in that post for feature suggestions, letting your voice be heard? I'm the one who even started that thread, so others could voice their opinions for features they would like to see. Again, where were you then? Hey, get a clue, I'm a SF user, just like yourself. I don't make the decisions of what makes it into the next revision release and what doesn't. So why are you breathing down my back? I asked for a VU meter in v4.5 of Sound Forge....It came to reality in v7.0. I asked for the ability for SF to be able to burn Disc-at-once CD's and for it to support CDtext back when SF5.0 was released. It finally came to life with the inclusion of CD Architect with SF v8.0. So look how long I waited for features I thought where important to my workflow. Obviously someone made the decision that they weren't that important enough to make the next version release and I even waited for 3 more version releases before they appeared. Guess what I did in the meantime? I purchased something else that would fill in the gaps in the meantime. Now you come in here complaining because SF8.0 is not getting multitrack wave support, after the feature list has been released? Then you're jumping on another users back who actually asked for the same feature? You are truly a dumb a**. So go breath your hot air somewhere else, because you are preaching to the choir.

If SF8.0 isn't what you hoped for, then guess what, you have the choice of not purchasing it, and buying something else that does.....or do as I have as a loyal Sound Forge user.....Wait patiently and continue to ask!!!

This is the first thread you've posted in this forum, and you admittantly come in saying you are very unfamiliar with CD architect and Vegas. You furthermore have not been using the Sony products nowhere as long as I have, where I have seen the direction the products are headed and how they integrate well together. But somehow you think you speak for the majority of the users, when I've at least been here on these forums for the past 8 years listening to them, where you've been posting for an entire week now. Then you say things like "those users who dared asked for
more were all burned at the stake." WTF are you talking about? This is a software tool, where you have choices of buying it or not if you don't like it. I asked for a sh*t load more features than made it into SF8.0, I don't feel like I've been burned at the stake. I'm pretty thankful, for SOME of the features that I asked for that did make it into SF8.0. At least I asked, which is more than I can say for you.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: sk

Date:1/29/2005 4:18:51 AM

With regard to Sony's policies after taking over the reins of Sound Forge, they said that they would upgrade ANY version of Sound Forge to 7.0 for $100.00. That was, in my opinion, a most generous offer too good to pass up. I had a fully licensed copy of 5.0, shelled out the $100, and got a fully licensed copy of 7.0. I'm not aware of any other company that's ever offered such a reasonable upgrade path/cost for a product one full step below the current (at that time) offering. That went a long way in my book in terms of good will. I just hope they do something reasonable with 8.0's upgrade cost. Given the new options, I think there will be a lot of SoFo users who will opt for the upgrade as long as the cost is fair and reasonable.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: spiderlegs

Date:2/1/2005 8:51:09 AM

What is the philosophy behind not adding multitracking functionality to SoundForge? I use CUbase for my sequencing and multitracking, but I would like to have a single program with VST, multitracking, mastering, the whole ball of wax. Is that asking for too much? Other than VST and DX support, the multitracking was the reason I use Cubase. I'm not thrilled with Cubase because I swear there are all sorts of inconsistencies between files even when the conditions are duplicated exactly. Oh well, maybe in version 9 they'll add multitracking?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: zendar

Date:2/1/2005 11:20:04 AM

lol spiderlegs, you might want to reread this thread...

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: spiderlegs

Date:2/1/2005 1:27:41 PM

Well, I read it until it became two guys arguing. What can anyone learn from someone's arguments (aside from the obvious human nature characteristics). To what are you referring directly? I really don't want to read someone's argument. I understand that CD architect can edit two stereo wave files, but I'm looking for something more like a multitracker with 12, 16, 24 tracks. I don't like Acid. It's a loop mixer. While many talented people use it, you don't have to be talented to make a half decent mix on it, and that, I'm sure, is part of its appeal. I feel like I have more control in Reason or Cubase, plus both of those programs have more of a "human" feel (yes, that's an ironic term) during composition, in my opinion. Maybe they could combine the multitracking capabilities of Acid (not so much the loop editing functions) with Soundforge. That would be aces to me.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: CDM

Date:2/1/2005 3:33:37 PM

why aren't you using Vegas?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Ben 

Date:2/1/2005 3:58:10 PM

> Maybe they could combine the multitracking capabilities of Acid (not so much the loop editing functions) with Soundforge. <

Charles is right - it's called Vegas. You should try it!

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:2/1/2005 7:40:06 PM

"I feel like I have more control in Reason or Cubase, plus both of those programs have more of a "human" feel."

If you think Cubase and Reason have more of a human feel then you should really look into Vegas. Vegas has the best user interface for multitracking on the planet.....well in most of our opinions in these forums anyway. Vegas is basically what you are asking for, it's just like Acid and Forge, but works like you described. If the Video features scare you, then just close those Windows out and you will never notice them.

Go back 23 posts from this one in this thread and you'll read where I previously described this before the arguing started.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: SHTUNOT

Date:2/1/2005 8:38:19 PM

Vegas>>rewired>>>acid= ;)

This to me solves many problems...And adds alot of others too. Those used to the very developed midi side of cubase and sonar will freakout when/if vegas gets rudimentary midi stuff. Personally I feel that vegas should stay the multitracker and the midi should just be developed in the next version of acid.

Ed.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: zendar

Date:2/2/2005 5:05:51 AM

Spiderlegs - arguments are a part of every worthwhile forum on the internet (in my opinion lol). As youve probably gathered from replies of others i was referring to the fact that vegas seems to do what you want.

The "argument" was about whether its a good idea to have a second lane for slipping fades and joins directly in SF. I think it is but understand it may well come along further down the line. It's important to keep mentioning it though, because sony seem to have picked up on other "nags" in this forum. I'm sure if they were honest sony would admit they learn from these "arguments" - front-line feedback from passionate users of their product can hardly be regarded as 'pointless'...

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: spiderlegs

Date:2/2/2005 8:51:45 AM

Fair enough, but at the time I didn't feel like wading through someone else's shitstorm.

I would try Vegas, but I've already invested in Reason and Cubase.I also need to upgrade to a new PC and get a better soundcard, which are priorities over software, currently. I was just trying to come up with a perfect all around , single product solution (perhaps I'm a little too perfect world, but I love SoundForge, and would like it to be more encompassing).

I won't give up Reason, I think it's an exceptional program and the most customizable softsynth/production tool I've used. I don't dig on its effects, but I use the Waves Bundle, anyway, so it's not an issue. I thought Vegas was mainly for video editing. I just don't need the video side of that program, and I don't want to use up my limited memory supporting a functionality that I don't use. Can you disable the video side of Vegas?

As far as Cubase is concerned, it's serviceable. I like it more than Elogic or Cakewalk or ProTools. I think CUbase has the advantage, too, on the utilization of VSTs. It's just buggy, but works well on my old PC.

Sell me more on Vegas, as far as a user's perspective is concerned.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: zendar

Date:2/2/2005 9:02:47 AM

well there's more info in this thread, rednroll does a great job of explaining why we like it, but i'd say give the trial version a whirl. i'd be pretty sure you won't have to refer to the manual, it really is a breeze to use.

ultimately it's what you're used to. i never got on with cubase logic or protools so for me vegas was a blessing. it was a DAW in version 1, then got more fancy on the video side, but as red says you can hide all that crap with no performance hit.

going full circle though, even though vegas is awesome, i do agree that it would be great to include just a couple of vegas touches to sound forge (specifically just give me that extra lane!) because at the risk of repeating myself: sound forge is sound forge and when i'm using that i don't want to have to swap around, and i wouldnt open vegas for the type of work i do in sf. i know it can be done, and i guess the point of the forum is to see if others feel the same way! the rest of the v8 changes are a sure sign that someone is listening...

cheers

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: drbam

Date:2/2/2005 3:24:18 PM

<<Sell me more on Vegas, as far as a user's perspective is concerned.>>

You should post this on the Vegas Audio forum. Better yet, do a search because this issue comes up a lot and there's plenty of user posts that speak to your request. And then, download the demo and find out for yourself. Do some serious editing with it and then go to Cubase (or Protools, or Nuendo, or Sonar, etc) and do those same edits. Make sure to keep track of how many moves it takes and how many windows or menus you have to access to accomplish the same tasks. Let us know what you find out. . .

drbam

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:2/3/2005 6:52:21 AM

"Sell me more on Vegas, as far as a user's perspective is concerned"

We shouldn't have to, Vegas is exactly what you're asking for. Vegas was developed to be an audio multitrack solution that was based off of the success of Sound Forge. It later got Video editing features added to it in V2.0, where the video editing features followed how Vegas was doing it for audio. So basically, if you where familiar with editing audio in Vegas, then now you already know how to edit video. The audio features continued to be developed but where soon over shaddowed due to the large attraction of the video user buying the product. Don't worry some of the audio users like myself continued to use the product and Sony/Sonic Foundry listened to our feedback.

If you're video editing user Vegas has a video preview Window, Video Scopes Window, Video media generators window, video transsition Window. If you're an audio user like me then, you just close all these windows out and they will never be in your way again, unless you decide to goto the views menu and reenable them.

The argument for having to pay for video features you're not going to use is a lame argument with no reason behind it. You're getting a multitrack audio program in the class of Protools,Sonar and Nuendo. Which is more than half the price of Nuendo and Protools. Adobe Audition/Cool Edit Pro is not even in the same class as Vegas to compare it, thus why Cool edit Pro is cheaper. It's not a professional audio solution like Vegas. I have Cool Edit Pro and Vegas, I will choose to use Vegas 365 days out of the year over Cool Edit. I also have Sound Forge, I will choose to use Sound Forge also 365 days of the year over using Cool Edits stereo editor view. If I was doing music as a hobby, and had a minimum budget, then I would recommend using CEP. I do this a little more than a hobby. The only reason I even had CEP still installed on my system is because I do a lot of audio system analysis work, where CEP allowed me to generate White, and Pink noise. It also allowed me to run statistics on a waveform and then copy that data to a clipboard, so that I could paste that data into a word Processor like MS Excell where I could further do math functions. SF7.0 got the pink/white noise generators, and Forge has always had a statiistics analysis feature, it just couldn't be copied to the clipboard. I'm betting I can uninstall CEP off my system for the release of SF8.0, for that one feature of copying to the clipboard that CEP had.

As an audio user of Vegas, think of Vegas this way. You're getting a fully functional multitratrack and getting video editing features for free if you decide to expand your workflow in that area. As I previously mentioned Nuendo=$1300, Vegas=$560, you do the math. The only drawback currently on Vegas is that it currently doesn't support Rewire, but don't count on it remaining that way. Vegas also doesn't have midi track support, but it does have midi clock syncing abilities which allows you to sync it with the midi sequncer of your choice. Thus you have a lot of flexibilty to work with that extra $740 you save over Nuendo if your workflow requires those features.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: spiderlegs

Date:2/3/2005 11:42:57 AM

I'd rather not go excavating for posts in the Vegas thread. If you'll indulge me, I only have a couple more questions.

The midi functionality is pretty important. You said it doesn't do Rewire or midi, those are both fairly important to the recording process I use. I use Reason constantly, so Rewire is important for syncing Reason to my analog tracks. I could export my Reason files as separate wav files and import them, but that will eat up alot of hard drive space.

I, too, do this as more of a hobby. I don't view Cubase as being too complicated to use at all, it's just "buggy" at times. At other times, it's great. I haven't used Nuendo, which I heard was unnecessarily complicated. Cooledit, Audition, Wavelab, et al, are all WAY inferior to SoundForge, IMO.

I'll download the Vegas demo and check it out, but without Rewire or midi, that means I have to get a compatible sequencer, too. Being on a budget, I don't want to spend the $700 I save on Vegas on another piece of software (or hardware) that I wouldn't need with my current setup.

Are you limited on number of tracks you can use? Or can you use as many as your PC memory will allow?

How are you able to "switch off" the video editing functions in order to save memory? Just curious.

I was unaware that Vegas began as an audio program that developed into a video program. I thought it was always a video program. Still, until it gets something more than just midi clock sync, it won't be the kind of tool I need. But, I am very curious about it now because of your responses. Thanks for the info, fellas. I appreciate it.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: BrianStanding

Date:2/3/2005 2:08:20 PM

"Are you limited on number of tracks you can use? Or can you use as many as your PC memory will allow?"

Unlimited tracks

"How are you able to "switch off" the video editing functions in order to save memory? Just curious."

Simple. Close the Video Preview, Video FX and Video Transitions Windows. Save this as your default workspace. Add only audio tracks to the timeline. You'd never know it was a video editor.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: spiderlegs

Date:2/3/2005 2:16:46 PM

Cool, thanks.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:2/3/2005 6:44:46 PM

Regarding Midi and Rewire. As I mentioned Vegas does not have midi tracks. You can sync Cubase or Reason to Vegas through midi clock sync, or Midi Time code. Seeing Acid has Rewire Host and Rewire Slave capabilities, I would expect Vegas 6 to follow suit and have Rewire capabilities next.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Lazarus

Date:2/5/2005 7:37:05 PM

Rednroll wrote:
> .. you come in here complaining because SF8.0 is not getting multitrack wave support

Er, I said: "I just hope that the ability to edit more than a single stereo track at once comes sooner rather than later"...

> Then you're jumping on another users back who actually asked for the same feature?

Now you're re-writing the thread. Read from the top - you're the only one doing the jumping. If you're offended by the
irony of your wailing about my multi-track suggestion having similarly requested this feature yourself, I apologize...

> You are truly a dumb a**[..] because you are preaching to the choir.

Yup, a mature and original response entirely in accord with the degree of literacy you've displayed thus far but it
doesn't quite compensate for the poverty of your argument. You're the one haranguing people over what they should
and should not expect of Sony media software. I merely point out the need for multi-channel support in SF. To repeat
(again!) it's daft to continue criticizing this desire when you have also expressed this need - as it would have been daft
for me to blather endlessly on and on, as you have, about using other multi-channel software when you suggested this
feature specifically for Sound Forge in another thread. That you don't see the pointlessness of your rant is baffling.

> This is the first thread you've posted in this forum [...] You furthermore have not been using
> the Sony products nowhere as long as I have [...] But somehow you think you speak for the
> majority of the users when I've at least been here on these forums for the past 8 years

Ah, bless. A nice shiny medal for you can't be far off, even if adulthood is. Clairvoyance isn't one of your talents though
as I've been using Sound Forge since around 1996 (long before it was under Sony). Some professional SF users I know
are too busy to post in any forum. Big deal. Neither have I even hinted that I "speak for the majority of users". Naturally,
for Sony's entire user base, even for Sony themselves, you alone are omniscient in this regard.

> If SF8.0 isn't what you hoped for [..] you have the choice of not purchasing it, and buying
> something else that does.....or do as I have as a loyal Sound Forge user.....Wait patiently
> and continue to ask!!!

For pity's sake, grow up. It's not a question of loyalty! Discerning users choose Sound Forge because they find it the
best at what it does, not because they've sworn an oath of allegiance. Waiting patiently and continuing to ask is EXACTLY
what I and others have been doing - as evident above - much to your peculiarly obsessive chagrin.

> I'm pretty thankful, for SOME of the features that I asked for that did make it into SF8.0. At
> least I asked, which is more than I can say for you.

Obviously, I welcome the new features in v8 - who wouldn't? Like some other pro users, I've had correspondence with
SF/Sony concerning multi-channel support more than once over the years. (The feature's omission has been a recurring
theme within reviews of Sound Forge in respected journals also.) You might ask yourself, however, why it irks you that
my communications haven't been aired in any arena where you have access.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: sk

Date:2/6/2005 10:50:19 AM

Welcome, Lazarus, to the sad, strange, pitiful world of Rednroll. His nonsensical blathering has been trashing this board for YEARS now, following the same tired pattern of bullying and ranting and quoting/misquoting on and on from his deluded perspective that HE is the only one who knows what's right for Sound Forge. (As well as everything and everyone else). He is the expert on audio editing; he is the expert on Sound Forge and all the other audio editing programs out there. He is the "moral majority" here on this board. And as a result, he has wasted more bandwidth than anyone I've ever met on any board anywhere. If you enjoy responding to him, great; if you think that it will change his mind - or his ridiculous behaviors - it's not going to happen. I have appealed in the past to more reasonable members here to stop encouraging him, but to no avail. He has singlehandedly, IMHO, brought more DISCREDIT to Sound Forge - not to mention himself - than any other human being on the planet. But he continues on...nonetheless...ad nauseam. He personalizes and perceives attacks from even the most neutral comments, turning otherwise constructive discussions into his own Quixotic campaign to rid the world of the whiners and SoFo-Bashers. His total lack of objectivity into his own motivations is pathetically apparent in virtually every one of his posts. And while I've heard other members support him - saying that despite his obnoxious behavior, he has managed to be helpful - the cons so outweigh the pros in that department that it's not even a matter of apples and oranges. (Tthough, I would suspect, not too far removed from the matter of a total fruitcake.) However, as long as Sony allows his to proliferate here, and be their "unofficial" spokesperson, the situation will, unfortunately, continue.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: pwppch

Date:2/6/2005 12:46:54 PM

We allow "Ignore This User" for just such problems.

Peter

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:2/6/2005 8:53:53 PM

'We allow "Ignore This User" for just such problems.'

That would be the one right next to my name within my posts. Please feel free to exercise that forum feature.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: kbruff

Date:2/7/2005 10:25:07 AM

I Cant wait for the release of SF 8.0(a), I am so curious as to what scripting will allow me to do.

This will be so interesting --

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: mpd

Date:2/7/2005 10:53:32 AM

I'm hoping that scripting will let you chain actions that can't really be done with the plugin chainer.

For example, most of the files that I produce have to have standard length handles on each end. I'm hoping that scripting will let me chain together add X ms silence to beginning, add silence Y ms to end, trim silence to Z ms.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: kbruff

Date:2/7/2005 11:59:04 AM

exactly.....

I need to apply a number of pluggins, then ...

(01) crop the file to 45 seconds in length
(02) capture the last 10 seconds
(03) from the 35 second point to the 45 second point apply an expontential fade out
(04) then save the file to mp3 24 kbps sample rate
(05) then create a new folder
(06) then create a text file which reports on the
06a) pluggins used,
(06b) the number of files
(06c) the file size of each one
(06d) the total file size of all files in the folder
(06e) then copy the folder and name it with the date and time in military format such as 020520051459

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: jetdv

Date:2/7/2005 2:16:01 PM

kbruff,

Can you e-mail me?

Edward

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: kbruff

Date:2/8/2005 5:59:05 AM

OK

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: pb

Date:2/13/2005 8:59:57 AM

What a lot of posts. I scanned through and saw Adobe Audition mentioned. I have an unopened copy I got with a Matrox RT X100 and am wondering if it is fairly simple to use, as in by my 14 y.o. nephew. I dare not ask this question on an Adobe forum because the members tend to be a bit passionate about Adobe products. Is it a useful program?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: PipelineAudio

Date:2/13/2005 7:41:53 PM

"'We allow "Ignore This User" for just such problems.'

That would be the one right next to my name within my posts. Please feel free to exercise that forum feature. "

I click it once in a while but then I forget what me and rednroll are arguing about

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:2/15/2005 6:24:43 AM

Peter (ie PB). Audition, aka Cool Edit Pro would be a good program for your nephew. On the PC side it was my second choice as far as ease of use/functionality when I was looking for a PC multitrack program. It would be comparible to having Forge and Vegas in one program, but nowhere as easy to learn and powerful as a Vegas/Forge combo. Audion does have a lot of features, that expose a lot of options that will be confusing as to their use for a 14 Y.O., because they border on the line of common engineering terms, but not so common to someone just getting into recording. Thus, although the UI is functional it is very technical also. So be prepared for a lot of technical questions you may be unable to explain, but be able to say, "just use a preset or the default settings and you'll be ok. " For a 14 Y.O., I would highly recommend a SF Studio/Vegas Movie Studio over Audition because the UI is a lot more intuitive, but if you have a free copy of Audition, then of course that's a good reason to go with that.

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:2/15/2005 7:14:35 AM

"I click it once in a while but then I forget what me and rednroll are arguing about".

Pipe let me summarize every argument we've had, and you'll see some simularities to the one in this thread.

Pipe:
I can't do this particular task, can someone tell me how to do it in Vegas? I can't understand why Vegas doesn't have this common feature that all the other apps have and I can't get any work done.

Red:
Vegas does have that functionality and here's how you achieve that same task. Step1, 2, 3, 4, ...etc.

Pipe:
I don't want to do it that way, I want to do it likes it's done in app A,B, or C.

Red:
Vegas doesn't currently do it that way, have you tried my suggested method?

Pipe:
No I haven't tried it but I want it to function this way like app A,B, and C does, why doesn't Vegas do it this way that I'm familiar with?

Red:
I'm familiar with how apps A,B, and C do it but after you get use to doing it the Vegas way you might find that you actually prefer doing it the Vegas way as I have. Give it a try as I suggested.

Pipe:
Ok, I tried it and it works, but I don't want to do it that way, I want to do it like it's done in apps A,B, an C!!!!!

Red:
Then why aren't you using apps A,B, or C if that's the way you want to do it and you are unwilling to change your workflow method?

Pipe:
You're the reason why Vegas doesn't do it like apps A,B, and C, so Vegas should do it this way also.

Red:
No, I answered your question of how to do the same task with Vegas because, you said it couldn't be done and it was limiting your workflow. I'm sorry it doesn't do it the way you want, but previously you said Vegas couldn't do this task and I just explained to you that yes it does and gave you the steps on how to achieve the same thing. I'm a user just like you are and I have no control over the way Vegas functions, aside from posting suggestions, so I suggest you do the same.

Pipe:
If you made music day in a day out for a living, then you would understand why it needs to be the way I want it to be......( followed by personal attacks of what you THINK I do for a living).

Red:
No I have made music day in and day out for a living for more than 6 years straight and I do understand what you're asking for and the need. I've also have done advertisement audio production for 3 years as well as having a college degree. I just outlined the way to achieve the same thing in Vegas that you said couldn't be done before. Sorry, but it was my choice to move myself away from having to depend on strictly doing music recording for a living, but I still do it as a part time job, where I find it more enjoyable because, I have my choice of who I want to work with and when.

You can see the same kind of thing happen in the above argument, where I'm just trying to explain or recommend a way to do it, but the other user is stubborn of how they want to do it and take it out on me because I suggested another method that contradicts to the way they see fit of how it should be done. Sorry, I can't help you out there, so why are you taking your frustrations out on me?

Subject:RE: Sound Forge 8.0 Press Release

Reply by: PixelStuff

Date:2/15/2005 9:11:49 AM

Adobe Audition used to be Cool Edit Pro before it was purchased from Syntrillium. Back then it was a really decent program. I haven't used it since then, but it should still be fairly nice I would think for an all-in-one.

JBJones