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Subject:Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Posted by: lclc
Date:9/14/2004 9:51:20 PM
Hi, I've read quite a few posts about how one can't record audio from a VSTi (mainly Grove Agent), and that the best thing to do is record a midi track, or use the piano roll feature, then play it through GA. Here's what I do to record audio straight from Groove Agent, Virtual Guitarist and B4. My sound card is an Aardvark DirectPro 24/96. It has 6 inputs for recording. 1 through 4 are mic/instrumnet jacks. 5 and 6 I can't technically explain how thy work. I'd say they're sort of "virtual". In Acid I choose "insert soft synth" from the "insert" menu, or Mixer Window. Then I choose Groove Agent. I set everything I need in the Groove Agent control panel and then click the Record button. I set inputs 5.6 in my sound card as Record device. Then I start recording and trigger GA from my midi keyboard, which isn't a midi controler, but is enough for what I need. I also tested this with my onboard sound card. It's pretty much the same thing but I have to go to Start / All programs / Accessories / Entertainment / Volume control / Options / Properties / Recording radio button and check " Wave out mix" . This way Acid records the output from Groove Agent. Of course I can't start recording from measure one. But I almost always need a one or two-measure count-in anyway. I wonder if nobody seems to use this method because there's some technical disadvantage I'm not aware of, since I'm a hobbyist. Later, LC |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: JohnnyRoy
Date:9/15/2004 6:12:12 AM
LC, I’ve never used Groove Agent but I wouldn’t put it in the same class as B4. What you are doing to record Groove Agent sounds correct. This is because Groove Agent is generating MIDI data that ACID can’t record as MIDI. So your only choice is to record the output of Groove Agent as audio data. B4, on the other hand, does not generate MIDI. It accepts MIDI as a virtual instrument and you do not have to record B4 in this way. ACID Pro will record B4 for you automatically when you render the file. If Groove Agent can be used standalone, then you could probably use a Virtual MIDI Router to route the MIDI OUT of Groove Agent into the MIDI IN of ACID. I’m just guessing here since I don’t have Groove Agent to test this. ~jr |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: Iacobus
Date:9/15/2004 11:34:13 AM
Why not record the MIDI track through Groove Agent first, then render the results to a new track? (Solo the MIDI track, set the Loop Region over the area you'd like to render and use CTRL+M with the "render loop region only" option to render the results to a digital audio track.) Much faster than having to re-record everything. Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page Guitars 4 Kids |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: Waskel
Date:9/15/2004 12:34:18 PM
mD, I think what he's trying to do is record the midi output from Groove Agent. It's capable of generating midi drum tracks. This can be recorded in Cubase, et al, but Acid isn't capable of recording midi produced from a VST, and GA isn't stand-alone. Therefore he has to capture the audio produced at the time. (If you already knew this, my apologies. [sheepish grin]) Wask. |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: Iacobus
Date:9/15/2004 1:00:47 PM
Ah, OK. Shoulda done my research as I usually do. Didn't know Groove Agent itself produced its MIDI on the fly. Forgive my ignorance. :) (See? Even a guy like me learns something once in a while.) Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page Guitars 4 Kids |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: Waskel
Date:9/15/2004 2:12:59 PM
haha, even a guy like you? Oh, the humility!! [kidding] Yes, GA is one of a few VST's that not only plays midi, but it can output the patterns it creates. It is unfortunate that Acid can't take advantage of this (another hint for V5?), as I have to fire up cubase and record enough tracks to give me an idea of what I want GA to do. Actually you can either preprogram pattern changes into 'memory' slots or manipulate it live as the sequencer is playing, and record the output as midi. Then you can play it back through GA or any other VST. (I've found Battery to have much better sound playing GA's tracks back than GA). Wask. Oh, one note: Eric's solution was nice, gets the output to audio, but one problem. The beauty of a product like GA is that after you've used it to generate the midi file, you can go back and edit all the late hits and other goofs you committed while recording it. Unless you use just one beat all the way through. With no fills or pattern changes. How boring. Anyway, after you edit your mistakes then you can listen to your flawless drumming technique through your fav drum sampler. Or GA. Whichever. |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: JohnnyRoy
Date:9/16/2004 5:22:49 AM
> unfortunate that Acid can't take advantage of this Are there any other programs besides Steinberg that can take advantage of this? I can’t think of any. SONAR and Pro Tools are the only apps that come to mind and neither of them supports VSTi’s natively. I’m wondering if the interface to read MIDI is proprietary to Steinberg and not a standard interface that others can implement. Does Groove Agent or Virtual Guitarist work with SONAR? ~jr |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: Waskel
Date:9/16/2004 5:53:58 AM
Good question. Now that you bring it up, I realize I've never tried it with anything other than Acid and Cubase, those being the programs I primarily use. I'll try it with Sonar tonight at home and let you know. "I was gratified to be able to answer promptly. I said I don't know." Mark Twain |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: lclc
Date:9/17/2004 4:45:46 PM
Well, Thank you all for the information. I actually know very little about midi. The last time I dealt with it was when I had Cakewalk 8. And I basically used the score writer feature. I never had the patience to learn how to use a piano roll. I guess I'll take the time to learn it now. It was at about that time that some of my friends showed me Vegas, Acid and Sound Forge. And I found it so much easier to work with audio. But it doesn't hurt to give midi a try. Thanks again, LC |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: spesimen
Date:9/18/2004 1:27:05 PM
or you could just use "render to new tracK' and do it automatically without all the muss and fuss plus you wont lose any audio quality or fidelity from resampling all that stuff or going through unessesary loops in and out of the card just record the midi first how you want it and you're good to go |
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Subject:RE: Is there anything wrong with recording audio from VSTi this way?
Reply by: Waskel
Date:9/21/2004 8:59:59 AM
lc, it sounds like what you're doing now is about the best you can do, using Acid. (Pretty good solution to your problem btw, kudos to your creativity). Technically, there's certainly nothing wrong with the way you're doing it, it's just that once you've recorded the output, you have to deal with it as an audio file, rather than midi. The beauty of midi, in the case of GA, is that after you've recorded the midi track you can go back and easily edit the information, and GA will play it back exactly the way you want it. But, if you're quick with your mouse, you can use GA to record the perfect drum tracks for your tunes! Wask. |