General Question: bad DVD burns

dand9959 wrote on 9/14/2004, 6:19 PM

Has anybody gathered any quantitative data regarding the frequency or causes of "bad burns" of DVDs?

The number of variables and their combinations are huge:

Type of player (some burns play on some boxes, not on others)
Type of DVD media (some players don't play + media, for example)
Brand of DVD media
Type of burner
What burning software used

I'm sure there are more.

In my experience, I use predominantly DVD-R Verbatim discs. I've burned mostly with Nero and/or DVD X Maker. (I'm new to DVD ARch). It seems that, maybe one in 10 discs burned with the identical image have a problem in some - but not all players; and I have not had the time, resources, or patience to determine the cause.

Does anybody know of any good studies on this problem?
What are some rules of thumb that you use to try to minimize "bad" discs?

Comments

ScottW wrote on 9/15/2004, 4:52 AM

First you have to seperate the concept of a bad burn from compatability issues.

There are some players that won't play a DVD-R no matter what. For this catagory of players, it's not a bad burn, but incompatability.

Another type of incompatability is where the DVD-R will play, but there are sometimes strange stutters or other artifact. Yet the disk plays fine on other players. I ran into this issue with one customer and finally traced the problem to small spikes in the bitrate where the problem was manifesting - the problem player just couldn't handle it.

Another imcompatability area is with the authoring software - each authoring package does things slightly different and not all players implement the spec the same way. So a fancy menu might work on one player but not on another.

So, if your 1 in 10 DVD's has an issue in some but not all players, you're dealing with compatability issues.

You can find a list of players that have known compatability issues with DVD-R media on the web. DVD+R media may be an option that will work instead with some of these players.

--Scott

dand9959 wrote on 9/15/2004, 6:42 AM

So, do you find that +R is more generally compatible with most players? I had read that -R was the most widely accepted..is that no longer the case?

(I'd rather burn to +R simply because it is quicker.)

I assume there is no real solution that guarantees compatible burns for all players...at least using PC-based burning capabilities...but it'd be nice to have a guideline to get as close as possible.

ScottW wrote on 9/15/2004, 7:52 AM

It depends on who you talk too. From the articles I've read, +R was designed from the very beginning to look more like a commercially stamped DVD, there's some significant differences in how certain aspects of the burning is done for example.

The biggest problem I ran into with +R was the booktype. Some players wouldn't read the disk unless the booktype specified DVD-ROM or DVD-R (since those were the only types defined at the time the player was built). However, with +R on *some* burners, you can override the booktype that gets written, and then +R looks to the player just like DVD-ROM. The problem is that only some burners would let you do this (at least that used to be the case; I've not investigated in depth with the latest dual-format burners). On the plus side, once I changed the booktype, the player objecting worked fine, and another player that wouldn't touch -R at all, also played the +R without difficulty.

Beyond the media compatability issues, there are also problems with the authored content. For example, we've had a couple of reports on this forum that DVDA 2.0 projects aren't playing correctly on some players, but the same type of project built with DVDA 1.0 plays fine. Well, the structure of some of the files did change between 1.0 and 2.0, so maybe that's the problem.

I've not seen a solution that promises compatability for everything - well, mabe using Scenearist to author and actually mastering your DVD - but not many folks can afford those solutions.

You can also do what a number of folks have done - tell the customer that if the DVD won't play on their player, they have 2 options: get a newer player (most players manufactured after 2002 are probably pretty safe bets), or you will offer a free VHS copy.

--Scott

INTENSE wrote on 9/16/2004, 8:26 AM

Whoa,
before giving the customer a free VHS which is probably not what they wanted being that they asked you for a DVD in the first place.

Try this:
Burn it on to a VCD format. Now I realize that you may have to put the video on 2 or three depending on the size of the video. 99% of all DVD players will play VCD's and also your Windows Media player will also play them.

One question is what software are you using to burn the DVD's. I haven't found any good software yet to burn DVD's even though I have a DVD burner.

dand9959 wrote on 9/16/2004, 8:34 AM

Yeah, the variations seem endless...

I've had a situation where a DVD wouldn't play on a particular player, so I burned another disc of the same media type, using the same image, same burner, and same burning software. And it played fine.

Sowhaddyagonnado?

ScottW wrote on 9/16/2004, 10:01 AM

My playing with VCD's suggests that there are even more compatability issues with them than with DVD's. I've not yet come up with the right incantations to get Nero to burn a VCD that either of my test players will accept.

ScottW wrote on 9/16/2004, 10:05 AM

"I've had a situation where a DVD wouldn't play on a particular player, so I burned another disc of the same media type, using the same image, same burner, and same burning software. And it played fine."

This would be the symptoms of a classic "bad burn" which is different then the compatability issues. Bad burns do sometimes happen.

johnmeyer wrote on 9/16/2004, 6:26 PM

DVDrHelp Compatibility Guide

DVDrHelp Media Search

Does bitrate and burn speed affect DVD compatibility?

gibbs wrote on 9/17/2004, 5:56 AM

I started a new topic not realizing that my problem is probably part of the same issues discussed here. I am new to DVDA 2.0 that came with the Movie Studio upgrade and I did a project for a customer yesterday that she tried on 3 different set top players and it would not play. It plays fine on the 3 players that I have. The same project using the same burner, media etc. authored with simple software like Sonic MyDVD played fine, so I am leaning toward the software in this situation. However, 50% compatiblity rate is not good for business, so I will probably discontinue using DVDA unless the problem is addressed.