lets face it ... -ACID Product Family - MAGIX Community Forums Archive

ACID Product Family

Subject:lets face it ... Posted by: mwalker Date:9/4/2004 7:56:38 AM with cubase sx3, live4 and sonar4, acid 5.0 must be a true smoker or they will out of business. i really think that there is no acid 5.0 because when was the last update, cubase, live and sonar have updated a few times. if there is a update how much do you think it will cost, i feel close to $249 (because 5.0 must be a total rewrite). lets keep it real it is time to move on to something else. i have move to live4 and it is all that and a bag of chips. but if there is an acid 5.0 it must blow sx3, live4 and sonar4 out of the water. anything else well ...
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: dabb Date:9/4/2004 8:31:18 AM I feel the same here Acid5 should have been released a long time ago. They may just have one or two guys working on this if any at all. Look's like they are porting everything over to Vegas. Remember Sony sells video recorders and software to edit , not synths and effect modules. What gets me is that they can't even make an announcement, even with a release date of first quarter of 2069 it would be good news. But their arrogance of snubbing Acid user's for years, well I'm fed up and moving my audio software dollars somewhere else. Guess they do not need my $$. I will continue using the buggy incomplete Acid4 for some things that it does do well and use some other software for the rest of my editing and recording (poor midi in acid). dabb
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: JohnnyRoy Date:9/4/2004 9:31:51 AM > I feel the same here Acid5 should have been released a long time ago. Let’s check the facts shall we. Sonic Foundry was going out of business. There last big effort was Vegas 4. The only way to save the company was to sell off some of its assets. Do you really think a company that is selling off its assets is going to invest development dollars in those assets? I don’t think so. Luckily, last fall, Sony acquired Vegas, Sound Forge, and ACID along with the exemplary development team that produced these products. They immediately started pumping dollars into development and produced Sound Forge 7, and Vegas 5, which btw had more new "Audio" functions that any release prior. Now it appears they are doing the same for ACID Pro 5 and have already released ACID Music Studio 5, which has new functions like reverse, metronome, and disk-at-once burning that we have all asked for in ACID 5. I’m sure that if Sonic Foundry was healthy and there was no need to sell off their software suite, ACID 5 would have been here already. But they weren’t, and it isn’t. Sony has publicly stated they are working on ACID 5, (ACID Music Studio 5 is proof of that) and neither Sonic Foundry nor Sony has ever pre-announced a release date so this is nothing out of the ordinary. None of us has any idea what the release date will be, but if you look at the recent events: i.e., the re-branding of the Screenblast series to the Studio series, and the release of ACID Music Studio 5, I’ve got to believe that it can’t be long now. It’s clear that Sony is serious about this software (otherwise why re-brand it?) so I’m not worried about its longevity. It’s just a guess, but it seems logical to me. If I were you, I would hold on to my dollars, go make some music, and wait for the announce of ACID Pro 5. Then decide if Cubase SX3, Live 4, SONAR 4, or ACID 5.0 is best for you. IMHO, it’s too close to be jumping ship now. With ACID Music Studio 5 out, ACID Pro 5 can’t be that far behind. I could be wrong, but everything seems to point in this direction. Just my 2 cents. ~jr
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: EPOX123 Date:9/4/2004 9:51:37 AM LOL first ACID® XPress, then ACID® Music, then ACID® Hip-Hop, then ACID® Latin, then ACID® Techno, then ACID®DJ, then ACID® Pro, then Vegas® Audio, then Screenblast® ACID®, then ACID® Music Studio, oh and dont for get Super Duper Music Looper LOL what in the world is going on, well i think sonicfoundry was trying to put out alot of versions to make us buy it agin to see whats new, only to find there is nothing new. sony is doing the same thing, but sony is make these programs more camercail so one day you will see this on tv and everyone will be a producer. thats great im out of a job now... sony need to delete all the old acid stuff and get rid of all the new crap there trying to sell and make one super killing machien. stop making the programes for ordinary people, this is for professionals. also this is just for acid emagin how the other programs are. i love sonicfoundry layout for programs "interface". but now sony you can improve the software so you can make more money. but from what i hear on this form your gona lose alof of custmers....
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: buckaroo Date:9/4/2004 10:11:38 AM Agree totally dabb... They are obviously not serious or else a small post would have been helpful Most Acid users will end up jumping ship with all these newer releases like SX3, Live 4, Sonar 4, not to mention Samplitude 8 (supposedly with loops) and Logic 7. Just any announcement so that all of these professional Acid users new where they stood in terms of an Acid 5 release date - Hats off to sony though, this must be the longest time ever between updates?!!! Sony, come on, you must read these posts....? Most of these people will end up using other applications and spending their $$$ elsewhere.. my 2 cents
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Iacobus Date:9/4/2004 11:25:38 AM If you came here looking for a flame war, you've come to the right place. I, for one, am sick and tired of these Chicken Little posts. You want to go use Live, SONAR, Cubase, et al.? Fine, go right ahead. Don't let me stop you. But choose Live over ACID? That's laughable to me. Sorry but it's my opinion, just as yours is that Live is better than ACID. I don't come here to read people whining and moaning that ACID is so far behind. I come here to help my peers. After all, this is a peer-to-peer forum. Official staff from SPD aren't obligated to come here but do so anyway from time to time. Frankly, we're talking animals of a different stripe here. Live is just a music tool. ACID is a music tool and a multimedia tool. For this reason, if I were to choose an alternative to ACID, I'd choose SONAR before choosing Live. (SONAR has multimedia support too). Again, everyone seems to be forgetting about another whole demographic: Multimedia producers. They're another market altogether. Also, ACID's paradigm is looping. It's not a MIDI sequencer nor was it meant to be. It's not a true multitracker (in the sense of being able to record several different tracks at once). Anything that's new that is introduced into ACID has to fit within this existing paradigm. Being able to playback MIDI wasn't even available until ACID Pro 3.0. Finally, I'm just going to have to come out to say those who slam Sony and ACID at every turn must have really low self-confidence in their abilties (or are just trolls looking for a fight). Seriously. I've tried to help those who are having trouble with ACID crashing and other problems dealing with functionality. Ultimately, I can't help them if they can't help themselves. Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page Guitars 4 Kids
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: rome Date:9/4/2004 11:48:46 AM I see what you're saying about Acid. Nothing out there completely does what Acid does. But they are closing in quickly. Acid's paradigm is a not midi sequencer. Although it is a feature. One that has kept Acid relevent. If it didn't exist then Acid would be somewaht of a niche tool for me. Long story short, what people are expecting from music programs constantly evolves. People are just impatient because of where Acid will stands in the face of Live or yes, one of the big three sequencers or my Ymaha Motif for that matter. It's a great place for Acid to be. The big three are realizing that they've got these incredibly powerful products that are so complex that the scare away new users and frustrate experienced musicians. Most of them have started dumbing down their technology to make it more accesible. Most still can't compete with Acid, cough project5, excuse me. Acid's biggest strength is it's ease of use. They've added pretty powerful features in v4 and it was still intuitive. This is Live's biggest hurdle. it does some great things but did it have to be that painful? For Acid 5, I'm hoping for the obvious obmissions from v4 plus better midi editing and some recycle type audio manipulation. At any rate I can't wait to see what it actually is.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: MyST Date:9/4/2004 11:49:44 AM "(because 5.0 must be a total rewrite)." LOL!!! Mario
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: forlornsoul Date:9/4/2004 8:01:11 PM I found that with Live 4 the tutorials and reading the manual let things fall into place easier than driving blindly. I don't think I'll get Acid 5 because of a) the wait, b) nothing concrete from them like a features list and c) Live is pretty cool with what it can do with regards to working with loops. And I haven't scratched the surface yet of Live 4. But what I have toyed with either briefly or a little (and I mean a little) deeper has me much more interested in it. Has anyone bothered trying out the Demo and looking through the tutorials? Maybe you'd quiet down a bit about Live itself over Acid. Just my opinion, I do not work for the company. Mike
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: DKeenum Date:9/5/2004 5:44:15 AM Doesn't Live have it's own forum?
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: JohnnyRoy Date:9/5/2004 7:13:33 AM > Doesn't Live have it's own forum? Yea, isn’t that the Where’s ACID 5? forum. ;-) ~jr
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: MyST Date:9/5/2004 7:57:22 AM For the record, I will admit that I really don't get this "complaining" at all. Does Acid work for you? Yes? Then stick around, I'm sure that it will EVOLVE nicely. Does it need a total rewrite? Hell no!! This is Acid, and if you need something that is completely different, then look at the vast options available that offer completely different features. Don't f*ck with my favourite looping app! I have yet to understand how people who use reasons like "It's taking too long" or "Others have had more updates than Acid" to move onto another app can be Pros. If I need Acid to do A, B, C, and D... why do I care if the others can do X, Y , and Z? They can do "A" and "B", but not as well as Acid. Well then I guess I'm sticking with Acid. Maybe I'm more "broke" than most of the posters here, because I sure as hell can't be spending hundreds of dollars here and there just because it's the latest app out there. I bought Acid Pro 3.0 because it was exactly what I was looking for. I upgraded to 4.0 because it had evolved into an even better app. I have no doubt that 5.0 will probably win me over as well. Sony will probably continue to have an evolutionary mentality regarding Acid, and to me, that's GREAT news! I'm done with these threads! I don't think it's worth wasting time explaining what Acid is to the people looking to have the latest gizmos. They'll move onto Live, or some other app, then when someone else offers newer features, they'll move on from Live. FWIW, I hope you find what you're looking for in whatever app you use. Me? I found what I wanted years ago...and it's just getting better, and better! Mario
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Kyoto Date:9/5/2004 8:04:32 AM Don't wish too hard for Acid 5 - Vegas 5 is a lot more buggy that Vegas 3! It's features are better, frustration level is worse!
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: JohnnyRoy Date:9/5/2004 9:31:01 AM > Vegas 5 is a lot more buggy that Vegas 3 Perhaps this is your experience, but I’ve been using Vegas since Version 3 and I now use Vegas 5 and it is just as solid as Vegas 3 was for me. I fact SONAR blows up all the time on me and Vegas 5 has never blown up once! I am very impressed with Vegas’ stability. ~jr
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: mwalker Date:9/5/2004 9:58:18 AM hey mD, you are very helpful here i must admit but i do not need multimedia. i have had acid since ver. 1 and the only point i am making is that acid 5 will have to be very special to compete in today music arena. period. MySt, i have been in the data processing field for more than 20 years and my experiences tell me that if acid is crashing as much as it does and there has not been a fix to fix the problems a re-write is needed. why add code to code that is not working as good as it could? acid is a nice product but the competition is nicer as of today 9/5/04. period. inclusion, when and if acid 5 comes out it must be extra special in order to keep it current user base and draw new users. period. no one is slaming acid but if they want my money it better be extra special. period. no flames here just the truth. have a nice day.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: DKeenum Date:9/5/2004 4:31:43 PM If you will carefully follow the threads where people complain that acid is crash prone... I'm talking about the ones where people follow through to where they find a solution, you'll see that acid is not the problem. I'm not saying that there are not any possible compatability issues. I'm saying that after all the time I'm spent here, I've seen a pattern: Someone posts that acid is crap and won't work. People respond with suggestions. The problem is fixed. But - the first post that blaimed acid isn't edited and coerrected. Do a search and see if I'm right. I may just be blowing smoke. Acid is rock solid for me.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: doddboy25 Date:9/6/2004 6:37:44 AM most of the time it's either your computer, or the audio card driver you are using that causes Acid to crash....not the software... my second to last update on my M-audio card was specifically for Acid Pro issues... I haven't had any problems with it... Acid is a simple and easy looping software that made all the other companies jealous so they decided to copy off of it... I don't want it to be busy and have a bunch of crap on it... if I wanted that I would buy Sonar 4.... or read manuals to figure out how to route midi in Logic... I didn't have to read a single word in the manual for Acid...and I never need to... that tells me it is a brilliant program anyone can use to make music... I have Cubase, Logic, and Vegas... and I don't ever use them... don't need to...if you want to do video get Vegas..thats what it's for...if just audio use Acid with Sound Forge, pure and simple...
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: jardeano Date:9/6/2004 8:23:18 AM where's rednroll ?.. when ya need him,,,,, yea ,, " lets face it",,, right no need to defend acid ,on this end ,, why do so many people keep responding to these posts? I had a vision when on acid last night ,, no , sorry ,, I mean working in acid , I saw a big "5"
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: doddboy25 Date:9/6/2004 10:28:00 AM it will probably come out this year... it has been long enough
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: HPV Date:9/6/2004 2:03:38 PM For everyone that has their panties in a bunch over when Acid 5 will ship and are still using Windows 98/ME....................... Let's just say you aren't going to be happy when Sony ships out the new ACID. Craig H.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Cquence777 Date:9/6/2004 5:14:46 PM I have to agree that these type threads follow the same basic premise every time....."when is Acid 5.0 coming out?". It always starts with a simple question, and then ends up in musical software flame war over what is better. Personally, I come here every day for one reason. To see if Acid 5.0 Pro is out yet or any official word on it's release. Once a thread gets into Live or Sonar or SX, etc, etc....I'm turned off simply because I could care less what they do....I'm not interested in them, period. Native forum users here (those that are always here and helping others) get tired of reading those types of threads over and over. Especially the one's that start off flaming Acid as a rebuttal to why it's new release is not out yet. That's all. BUT, it still does not change the fact that Sony "should" develop a release date policy for it's consumer base! It is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard of to say to your consumer base "we do not give out that kind of information". That's ludacris in my opinion. I still believe that is what causes people's emotions to rise over this topic. In my opinion, it doesn't really matter whether posters are justified in what they say or not....the fact is still the same.....there is no new info to keep them interested or to keep them quiet with anti-Acid rhetoric. Just my opinion
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Iacobus Date:9/6/2004 7:01:01 PM You'd have to be a fool to not realize that ACID Pro 5.0 is not going to be supported under Windows 9x/Me. Just about every audio app is going or has gone in that direction, whether it's Sony's apps or another's. Vegas 5 and Sound Forge 7 are supported under XP/2000 only. So are the new "lite" versions like ACID Music Studio 5.0. I fear Craig may be onto something here though. There probably will be some whining and moaning but we'll see. Cquence: Sony does seem to be throwing us a bone here and there, as evidenced by the recent release of ACID Music Studio 5.0. To be honest, a lot goes on behind the scenes to prepare for the eventual release. I know because I've beta tested before (for various companies). Some things may come up that might delay the release. That's why they can't ever give a definitive answer, as they end up angering those they've "promised." (I use the term loosely because it's really not a promise nor should it be taken as one, but apparently some do take it to heart.) Sony, of course, is under no obligation to state publicly what's going to be in ACID Pro 5.0 before its release (for obvious reasons). What's definitely known is that it's under development (as Joel and Peter have mentioned). All that's being asked is that people be patient. Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page Guitars 4 Kids
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: JohnnyRoy Date:9/6/2004 8:41:37 PM I understand wanting a date but dates are meaningless. Melodyne promise a plugin version of their looping tool (Melodyne Uno) in August and I couldn’t wait to get it. Then August came and went and now the date is October. I’m not holding my breath. So if Sony doesn’t give you a date you’re mad. If Sony does give you a date and they miss it, you’d be mad. Either way you’re mad so what’s the difference? ACID Pro 4 still records and plays back my songs just fine. When ACID 5 gets here, that will be icing on the cake. Nothing I’ve seen comes close to ACID so I’m not going anywhere. ~jr
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Cquence777 Date:9/7/2004 6:51:40 AM mD - I have also beta tested for software companies as well. Quartz Audio Master was one in which I did extensive testing and was the ultimate reason & help for implementing MMC support mainly due to HD recorders such as the VS880 back at that time. I do know about behind the scenes yes. So I do understand your stance on supporting Sony and supporting the products that they put out.....as do I. In response to JohnnyRoy, you're probably right regarding release dates and sticking to them.....and people getting mad anyway....for some users. But I honestly don't think that I would be mad myself as I understand the ups and downs and turns of software development. I'm not going anywhere either....nor am I saying that I am. I definitely don't come here and write threads about "when is Acid coming out" or "I'm leaving Sony if it's not soon". I am waiting patiently like everyone else. I guess I was merely saying that one word in Acid 5.0 Pro makes me think of it in terms of a higher standard. "Pro". Pro has basically come to mean "more features" in regards to any type of software....but the reality is, Pro takes the software to a new consumer base. I look at it like two companies doing business together....and this place (their website in general) is the only "personal face to face" info that you get regarding relations with Sony (for me anyway). I am only suggesting "timeline"....not release date. But also, understand that I am not disgruntled with what I have now....Acid 4.0 Pro is very much an essential tool for me. I'm not going away just because there is a wait for a newer/updated version.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Rednroll Date:9/7/2004 7:06:05 AM "where's rednroll ?.. when ya need him,,,,," What? Did somebody say something? :-). I have to agree with Myst's last post. If you're ready to jump ship, then you probably don't use Acid in a professional working environment. You're probably one of these users stealing every app that becomes available, so financial burden is not a problem for you. More importantly, is the effect of how jumping ship would have on your work flow. If the other app has X,Y,and Z features that Acid DOESN'T and also has features A,B, and C that Acid DOES, then that is great. I'm also glad you have all the time to jump ship and learn how to use an entirely different UI to be able to use features A,B, and C. I personally, don't have time to learn other apps and become effecient working with them....which is expected from you if you're using an app in a professional working/paying environment. I also don't have time to find out in that working environment that the new app I just jumped to, that I can't do features D,E, and F in an effecient manor that I could in Acid. If you can just jump ship for every new flavor of the week, then you probably don't use you apps in the same kind of working environment that I do, and interupting your whole workflow is not that big of a problem for you. This means, you're probably just working on your own personal material and the only one you effect is yourself when you change apps. I say good for you, but when working in a professional working/paying environment your change also effects your clients and their expectations. Clients are not so understanding when it use to take you 5 minutes to do a particular task for them, and now it takes you 3 times as long, because now you have a new learning curve you're working through and also the new app you have to do 3 more steps to do that particular same task. Right now using Acid Pro 4.0 with my other suite of software in my current working environment, I can do everything that everyone else can do using the latest Ableton Live, Cubase SX, Sonar 4.0...etc. I have no need to jump to those other apps. Now if I can take those apps that I currently have and am effecient in working with them, and make my work flow even more effecient, then I'm a happy camper. This means I'm waiting for Acid Pro 5.0. For example right now for my midi sequencing needs I'm using Opcode's Studio Vision on a Win98 machine, and have it synced with Acid for it's audio loop power, which is on a seperate WinXP machine. This setup works for ME in an effecient work flow. Acid currrently can't compete with Vision's midi features. I also haven't found a new shiny other tool that can compete with Vision's midi sequencing UI that fits my style of workflow. I gave my feedback to Sony engineering of midi sequencing limitations along with some suggestions and some of the workflow limitations I currently run into like the ability to only be able to record one audio track at a time in Acid when laying off my midi tracks to audio. Right now my work around is to open up Sony Vegas 5.0 which has a similar UI as Acid and export my audio loops from Acid into Vegas. So there's no learning curve adjustment in my workflow when working this way. Now if Sony listens to my feedback and can make my workflow more effecient, I will be truly happy. This means I won't have to spend time learning some other app and totally disrupting my current workflow. For that to happen I'm more than patient to wait a long time for Acid 5.0's release.....more patient than learning an entirely new app and becoming frustrated with it's UI of trying to figure out how to do the same things I use everyday effeciently in Acid. If Acid 5.0 doesn't address any of the workflow limitations I currently have, then I just keep my current workflow and wait patiently. As far as Acid being unstable for some users, I would expect some of that is due to the fact Acid 4.0 is Win98/ME compatible. There are a lot of limitations/obsticles that go into the code when working with audio on a Win98/ME machine. Sony will probably drop the 98/Me support as the rest of their apps that proceeded Acid 5.0, and you will see a more stable, more effecient operating Acid 5.0.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: mwalker Date:9/7/2004 7:43:55 AM the point is in any business there is a business plan short, med and long term. sony has crapped sonic foundry short, med and long term plans and came up with there own, that is why the the acid 5 update is taking so long. just because an indivdual uses acid in a professional sense (pro studio) does not make he or she better than the next bedroom producer. we are all customers. period. plus, the grass today 9/6/04 looks greener with cubase sx3, live 4, sonar 4, etc. period. not saying that acid 5 will not rebound. there was a time where acid was number 1 on the block, one of a kind app. now they are in 4th or 5th place as 9/6/04. period. i have invested into acid since ver 1and personally it is time for an upgrade because cubase, live4 and sonar4 are so temping.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Rednroll Date:9/7/2004 8:40:03 AM Sorry, I didn't mean for my previous post to imply that any user is better than another. Acid is broad enough where it appeals to many types of users. You should be able to see that in this thread alone to see how different users use it for different reasons. If you go back and read my last post you can see in no way, I said one user was better than the other. I agree with you that it's been a long time since a new release of Acid. Sony has an entire suite of software products CD Architect, Vegas, Acid, Sound Forge, and DVD Architect. I own that entire suite of products. I'm sure like every other company, Sony doesn't have an infinite amount of resources to make sure there is a yearly update and also to ensure common functionality is maintained between these products. This software suite integrates with each other very well. If you're looking for one software product to do everything for you as far as multimedia (ie audio,video, midi), you won't get it in Acid, but with the combinations of all their products you can pick and choose what features you need and will be more effecient in your particular workflow and don't have to learn 5 different products, because UI functionality is maintained between all their products. Does Albeton Live allow you be able to author DVD movies? How about Video editing like Vegas? NO. Since Sony has taken charge there has been a new release of Sound Forge, Vegas, and DVD Architect. That's three new releases. How many new releases has there been of Albeton or Sonar in that same time frame of about a year and a half? Probably one, compared to 3 new Sony releases that all integrate well together. I know a lot of the engineering resources that work on those other particular Sony products are also working on ACID. Peter is one of them. I can tell you the week after Vegas 5.0 was released he was asking users for Acid/Vegas feature suggestions where Acid was his new focus after Vegas. If you have the time and money to jump ship everytime another software developer has a new release with their latest and greatest bells and whistles then I am happy for you. We will welcome you back when you start crying about what Albelton Live doesn't have that Acid 5.0 does and how Acid's UI is so much better. I personally don't have the time or money to keep jumping ship every six months and to learn how to use another program when my current suite of Sony products along with Opcode's Studio Vision does everything you can do in Albeton Live and then some. I guess I just look at things different than you. You seem to look at ACID and what it has in comparison to the similar music production software, as I look at it as it's particular function within the entire suite of the Sony products I own. I look at the Sony products this way in comparison to all the other apps. The other apps are like a swiss army knife. They do a little bit of everything, but are specialized in nothing. Where in ACID, Vegas, DVD Architect, Sound Forge, and CD Architect you have a specialized tool for individual tasks. If you need a particular feature you don't have with one tool, you buy the additional tool that does. It's like doing brain surgery. Sure you could do brain surgery with a swiss army knife, but I rather have the individual specialized tools to do a better and more precise job.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: mwalker Date:9/7/2004 10:00:53 AM rednroll, i totally agree with you but i do not make dvd or multimedia projects. my point is, i do not want to keep switching from app to app. i have used cubase since ver. 1, now we are at sx3 and i do not want to upgrade to sx3. live4 gives me (which i brought last week) the cross between cubase and acid 4. acid is a product with allot of potential and if sony would give us a few words on the release of acid 5 this convo would not be taking place. i would like a stable, easy to use, midi, rewire, vst, pattern base/linear sequencer, multi recording audio track, great sound engine, time stretches, etc all in one app. i have a vested interest in acid and would like to know what is going on so i do not have to keep switching apps. no flames here just two individuals with the same opinion but different ways of voicing thems.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Iacobus Date:9/7/2004 10:30:05 AM I've actually tried Live 4, and I can say with an enormous amount of confidence that it isn't for me. Maybe its MIDI features are pretty good, as I'm really not into MIDI all that much anyway, but its digital audio left a lot to be desired. (Is there even a track bouncing feature? I couldn't find one.) And here's the kicker: Live can't read the ACIDized info for an ACIDized sample. You would have to play around with Live's time-warping controls to futz around trying to get the samples right. While most material, if prepared correctly, probably won't have a problem, what about custom material? All you have to do in ACID is set the Loop Region over the area you want to bounce and bang, instant loop, complete with tempo and key info (if applicable). Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page Guitars 4 Kids
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Rednroll Date:9/7/2004 12:10:44 PM mwalker, It has been mentioned numerous times that Sony/Sonic Foundry does not give release dates or a list of guaranteed features that will be in a future release. It has always been their policy since you purchased Acid v1.0, so you should know this is their policy. There are obvious problems that come along with releasing this type of information ahead of time. That being the developer is stuck to the time frame and if you don't meet it, then there's a 100 users upset in these forums saying...."you said this was going to be the date!!!" Well, obviously a better benefit for everyone is to release a product when it is ready.....not rushing it out the door because they promised everyone some delivery date. The same type of thing happens with feature lists. If they list the targeted features ahead of time and get everyone's hopes up, and then run into problems while trying to implement them, then they have two choices. Either to elliminate it, where you get users saying, "well you told me it was going to be in there, so I held off buying something else and now it doesn't have it." or putting that feature in there and having it work with bugs. I'm sure there's a few Steinberg users who can share some stories with you of how they where promised a feature ahead of time and then when it was released the feature was in there, but wouldn't function properly and would cause consistant crashes. I beta tested Vegas 4.0 and in the early beta builds there was audio/event reversal, but there ended up being problems with the way it was handled in the trimmer window. SoSofo, realized there was more work that had to be done to make the feature function properly. So they could have released it that way or took further time in pushing back the release date and getting bombarded by similar complaints as you are doing. They decided to pull that feature from Vegas 4.0, because users still had the option of using Sound Forge to achieve the samething, then continued to develop it so that it functioned properly for the Vegas 5.0 release. So obviously there's a double edged sword to walk on. You decide which side of the sword works for you best. There's a reason I'm not using Steinberg apps. I've tried them and have not been half as pleased as I am with the Sony apps. There's a reason why the UI of the Sony apps is so well liked by many. It's because Sony takes a lot of time in developing that UI and doesn't sacrafice on the UI to ship the product out the door because they made you a promise deadline. As far as I know, they're working on a new Acid 5.0 release. When and what will be in it won't be known until the day it's released, just like all there other releases. You may have a vested interest, but there was never any guarantee that regular version updates would be available with every feature you would like it to have when you originally purchased the product. So nobody owes you anything. You paid for the product you originally got and all the features in it should work correctly. That's what you paid for, nothing else. If you expect more than that, the only way to do it is to start writing your own code and making your own programs. I purchased Opcode's Studio Vision 10 years ago for the PC. There was one release and one bug update. No other releases followed that and later the company got purchased by Gibson guitars, who never continued any further development. Am I upset? I'm a little disappointed because I really liked that program and would have liked to see it progress on the PC side, but the program still does what I originally purchased it for and I have continued to get many years of use out of it.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: doddboy25 Date:9/7/2004 2:02:11 PM good points all of you... I have tried all the other apps... and Acid is still my drug of choice...
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: DKeenum Date:9/8/2004 5:35:41 AM And its legal!
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Zacchino Date:9/9/2004 6:02:17 AM So the conclusion to these posts is : Acid is our favourite legal drug. That doesn't mean that the SonyTeam are a bunch of pimps... Well... At my point of addiction I think they tottaly are ;).
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: JohnnyRoy Date:9/9/2004 6:31:37 AM > That doesn't mean that the SonyTeam are a bunch of pimps Hmmm... I thought a pimp pushed flesh and a dealer pushed drugs. Perhaps I’m just getting old and out of touch. (wow, this thread has certainly wandered off course) ;-) ~jr
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: dbOS://00 Date:9/9/2004 2:01:24 PM I have used Acid since version 2, I don't have problems with my computer, workflow, or even midi implimentation. I come to this forum to learn more about this program. I used to read people's questions about music/media production, and sometimes those questions were answered, sometimes they were not. Now every time I come to these forums, all I see is "when is acid 5 going to be released", or "this program is buggy" (which is a bunch of horse crap) If you can't get Acid to run smothly, do some research and disable some services, remove your NIC, (and any non-media production software for that matter) and get ready for testing, because you are about to build a workstation. If you are not ready for that, or are afraid of disabling some service required to boot, make a boot CD. Perhaps it isn't the OS, but your motherboard chipset, or even your sound card. maybe the problems lay in the user's incomplete understanding of the program, which means that no matter what program you use, the logic you apply to media production will still be lacking. to those of you that feel that there is a better program, cool, I am glad you have found something that works for you. This forum however is an ACID user forum, not a sonar forum or a live forum. You like LIVE, go to abeltons website, and tell the other live users, I'm sure they'd love to hear it. If you are bitching for the sake of bitching, then there isn't going to be anything that anyone can say to help you. I didn't have two cents, so heres a nickel
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: DKeenum Date:9/10/2004 5:32:58 AM Well said.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: mwalker Date:9/11/2004 6:19:18 AM yo db0s1yo, no disrepect but i own cubase 3.X, cubase sl, live 4, reason, and tons of other software on my laptop and they do not crash like acid pro 5 does. period. let say i have $5000 worth of music software on my machine and only one program give me problems is acid. is it the machine or the software. on my lappy there is only music software no internet, dvd or spreadsheets. would you think that acid is the problem? or if you purchase acid you have to be lucky to get it work. you tell me? there is nothing wrong with you/you guys and gals supporting acid but there are allot of us that are having crash issues with acid. period. that is a fact, no matter how much money or tunes you have wrote or what. no flames here just ones opinion. by the way live4 is not perfect either because live4 crashes with lounge lizard 2 everytime i use it. acid crashes when i am just recording one track and that is a basic function.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: JohnnyRoy Date:9/11/2004 8:50:39 AM > no flames here just ones opinion. None here. I have been on both sides of this problem. I’ve had software run solid when everyone else says its crashing and I’ve had software crash all over while other similar applications on my PC work fine and everyone else says its solid. Perhaps there is a particular VSTi or plug-in that is causing the instability. Perhaps its that one program interprets a specification stricter than another and so it is more sensitive to plug-ins that are out of spec. Whatever the reason, its no fun on the receiving end and I believe you. You might consider helping Sony (and the community) by narrowing down the crash to a particular set off steps and then email or call technical support with your reproducible test case to see if they can recreate it. It will help them make ACID 5 a more stable platform for you and us. ~jr
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Iacobus Date:9/11/2004 11:55:45 AM <iyo db0s1yo, no disrepect but i own cubase 3.X, cubase sl, live 4, reason, and tons of other software on my laptop and they do not crash like acid pro 5 does. ACID Pro 5? Or did you mean 4? Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page Guitars 4 Kids
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: mwalker Date:9/11/2004 12:36:00 PM mD, i meant 4, sorry about that. when acid pro 4 crashes on me i am laying a vocal track down on a mixed instrumental track (no vsti just wave/acid files). that should be a basic function, true or false? the soundcards i use are echo indigo i/o, tascam 424, m-audio ozone and moblepre.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: jardeano Date:9/11/2004 12:48:51 PM "the soundcards i use are echo indigo i/o, tascam 424, m-audio ozone and moblepre." how do you have these sound devices configured? not all on the same machine?
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Zacchino Date:9/11/2004 8:05:31 PM (mD) >ACID Pro 5? Or did you mean 4? mD, aren't you betatesting AP5 ? I mean, is there a betatest/alphatest avaible yet ? JohnnyRoy ? Anyone ?
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: JohnnyRoy Date:9/11/2004 9:05:02 PM If anyone was beta testing AP5 they would not be allowed to say because of the Non-Disclosure Agreement (NDA) that beta testers must sign. ~jr
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: dbOS://00 Date:9/12/2004 3:27:02 AM "the soundcards i use are echo indigo i/o, tascam 424, m-audio ozone and moblepre." on a laptop, and you have two different versions of cubase, which would mean two dongles. that is a lot of i/o realestate, what kind of processor are you using, and what chipset. perhaps there is an incompatability between one of your sound cards and your motherboard chipset. I had an ozone once. Maybe mine was defective, but it never did for me what I had hoped it would be capable of doing. Delta 1010 however is a wonderful sound card
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: MyST Date:9/12/2004 7:38:10 AM "mD, aren't you betatesting AP5 ? I mean, is there a betatest/alphatest avaible yet ? JohnnyRoy ? Anyone ?" Hmmm. That reminds me, I should go out fishing more often. I mean, if others can find the time to do it, why shouldn't I? ;-) Mario
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Iacobus Date:9/12/2004 8:40:20 AM mD, i meant 4, sorry about that. That's OK. I just got confused and thought I was in a time warp. Or something. :) when acid pro 4 crashes on me i am laying a vocal track down on a mixed instrumental track (no vsti just wave/acid files). that should be a basic function, true or false? the soundcards i use are echo indigo i/o, tascam 424, m-audio ozone and moblepre. I do the same thing with digital audio; I record takes while monitoring playback. I use an Echo MiaMIDI (frequently) and an M-Audio Audiophile 2496 (rarely) but I haven't seen a crash in only God knows when (especially since upgrading to Windows XP). Which interface are you using at the time when you record? The MobilePre? Are you using the same interface for playback? I remember a couple others having problems with the MobilePre but Jenn from Sony said she couldn't repro. Apparently this one person with the MobilePre found a solution but failed to divulge any info. Be absolutely sure no devices are sharing system resources. Even though Windows may report everything is A-OK, the devices themselves may not like to share. Do you get a crash dump? Copy and paste it here. If anyone was beta testing AP5 they would not be allowed to say because of the Non-Disclosure Agreement (NDA) that beta testers must sign. JohnnyRoy is indeed correct. It is very common for beta testers (of Sony or not) to sign an NDA. Otherwise, if the beta tester found out you knew they'd have to kill you. (I'm kidding! Heh...heh...heh...heh...) Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page Guitars 4 Kids
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: rmeuk Date:9/12/2004 9:23:06 AM >>That reminds me, I should go out fishing more often. I mean, if others can find the time to do it, why shouldn't I? ;-)<<< Yeah, why pick on Sony. Let's kill some beautiful fish instead! Makes you feel really cool. I hope there will be a superior lifeform than humans soon that will go humanhunting. Don't complain when you are the first victim. It's perfectly ok, isn't it? :D
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Rednroll Date:9/12/2004 12:40:15 PM Oh geesh.....not some animal rights activest coming into the mix now with their facts all screwed up. Maybe they need to go read some Darwin books of survival of the fittest and how evolution has been happening for a very long time. I think there's been quite a few shark attacks on humans, when humans are out of their environment and in an environment better adapted by sharks. I guess those sharks don't know anything about human rights when they're hungry too. Save the fisheys.....oh wait those fisheys are eating other smaller fisheys....save the smaller fisheys....oh wait those small fisheys are eating small parasites....save the parasites....oh those parasites are eating the living plankton....save the plankton. Hey smart guy, it's called a food chain....time to realize what part of the food chain you belong in.
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: MyST Date:9/12/2004 1:15:59 PM LOL!!! Mario
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Iacobus Date:9/12/2004 1:26:49 PM Mmm...fish. smacks lips I was watching Discovery HD the other night that had some great white shark show on. (Forgot it was called. "Swimming with the Great White"?) There was this woman who was taking photos of the sharks. She took that, "Oh, they're not so bad...they're actually quite gentle and docile" attitude...until Jaws decided she looked pretty tasty. It was actually hilarious to watch them try to wiggle their way out of the situation (which they did). It's as bad as that guy who loved bears so much...that is, until he got eaten by one. Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page Guitars 4 Kids
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Spirit Date:9/12/2004 1:30:55 PM That bear attack audio/video was awful .... the guy starts by mucking about with the bear, then it attacks him, you hear things getting serious. Then his wife (?) comes over to try to help. But no sucess - the bear kills the guy, then turns on the women and kills her too. Most of the attack was captured on videocam audio. The few scattered remains were found by the pilot who came on schedule to pick them up about a week later. Yech ! Still, what a twit. Muck with wild animals and you get what you experience what nature intends. --- moo moo moooo-ooooooooooo
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: MyST Date:9/12/2004 1:43:09 PM A few years ago I went to a zoo (Oh, here comes the activists now!!). This guy thought the wolves looked soooo cute that he decided to pet one of them through the fence. I haven't heard a person yell that loud since that day. It was wierd seeing a mass of people moving in unison from the wolves enclosure and make a direct line to the first aid station. Oh, and outrage... for the record. I'm sure you could tell that my post had little to do with fishing, and was more a statement that it was obvious the referenced post was aimed at extracting info. I personally gave up sport fishing years ago, for the simple reason that I thought pulling a fish with a hook in it's mouth while it's trying to fight for it's life, maybe wasn't the best way for me to entertain myself. But that's my personal reason for giving it up. I don't expect others to think the way I do, and it's not my concern if they do or not. I ended up finding a better way to entertain myself...with Sony apps! :-) Mario
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: DKeenum Date:9/12/2004 2:35:05 PM And we have those pasty white studio tans!
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: JohnnyRoy Date:9/12/2004 5:13:48 PM Hey. I work hard on my studio tan. ;-) ~jr
Subject:RE: lets face it ... Reply by: Snappy Date:9/18/2004 6:39:53 PM re: original topic. Well, Sonar is my balls, so it shouldn't be too hard to ... ahem ... 'blow' that away! As for these others, I don't know what they do, but if they don't do the auto-loop tempo/key matching thing that Acid does, then what is the point of portraying them as competitors?

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