It's up to you guys... AP's future -ACID Product Family

ACID Product Family

Subject:It's up to you guys... AP's future Posted by: Zacchino Date:12/6/2003 6:24:41 PM I'm just wondering and i have questions i tryied to figured out recently in this forum... I'll make it simple : When Sony© bought Acid Pro... What did they have in mind ? Keeping on doing a loop tool ? Or developing an enhanced sequencer ? Will AP5 be a simple upgrade ? Or a drastic change in Acid's line ? PS : Sony's Hardware & Oxford plugins for Sony's music creation tool... Obvious ! That makes sens ^^. Nice one Jim !
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: pwppch Date:12/6/2003 8:57:02 PM Sony is commited to further developement of all the products. Define "simple" vs "drastic". >>PS : Sony's Hardware & Oxford plugins for Sony's music creation tool... Obvious ! That makes sens ^^. Nice one Jim ! << Realize that Sony Picture Digital purchased the SOFO product line, not the Sony Professional Audio division (or the Oxford group.) Don't assume that just because we all have the same first name, that we can just share technologies how ever we want. We are very aware of the resources available to us from the larger Sony family. We will take advantage of them in the best way possible. This is not meant to imply that there will or wont be any merging or sharing of technologies. Q: Do you realize how much the Oxford plugins sell for? Would you be willing to pay a premium for this technology - say the same price as PTools users do to get the Oxford Eq? What Sony hardware are you interested in? How does it fit with ACID? (or any of the Media Software Divisions products?) Peter
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: Zacchino Date:12/7/2003 5:24:35 AM Thanx for replying on a saturday (Impressive ^^ when do you guys sleep ?) I'm sure that Sony Pictures will definitely invest some $$$ to get you licences, and new software technologies. By saying "simple" i meant "Without taking any risk"... Let me explain before you get pissed : When you added VSTi support, you decided that Acid won't be a simple loop tool anymore in a way. Which means that you spent time and money embedding a technology. Which was a "good move" finally. That's what i call a "drastic" change. You made a step foward to nowdays software sequencer's standard. What i'm afraid of, is that you decide to keep this baby out of the PC Software Sequencer race, just to stick to what it was always meant to be : a loop tool. I don't know if you understand what i'm saying (sorry i'm french). For Oxford Eq's and Compressors... Yeah i know it's expensive. That's why i thought of a "Professionnal" version of Acid and a "Standard" version. One dedicated for the studios, and another for the home-studios. Sony Hardware ? The DMXR100 (with its motorised faders). Or a customed "light" version of it dedicated to Acid Pro. The BIG Issue in the audio industry, when you're buying hardware; is the CHOICE. If a hardware is dedicated to a software, no more choice, which is good because the customer knows that he's buying the right hardware that'll fit his working vision.
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: MyST Date:12/7/2003 12:10:27 PM Sonic Foundry's vision at the time was to develop Acid as much as possible while still staying true to it's intended purpose...the best looping software on the market! Only Peter and the rest of the guys/gals on the Acid developement team know if this is still the rule under Sony's ownership. M
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: jtxx000 Date:12/7/2003 12:18:38 PM I don't like the idea of two different versions. I think that Acid should be both a looping program and a sequencer. This way you get the best of both worlds. As for the Oxford plugins, I really don't know much about them, but they should be an accessory, not come with the program.
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: Spirit Date:12/8/2003 7:57:47 AM Well, if we're talking "big vision" then I'd like to see it develop into the best audio app. Brilliant loop-handling is one part of it; much improved chopping, mangling, re-arranging and file management is the other. Midi is nice but I'd rather not have it if it means less developed audio.
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: pwppch Date:12/8/2003 11:36:18 AM >>Let me explain before you get pissed : I am not pissed, or upset in anyway. I am here to have a dialog as I find what is discussed here important. >>When you added VSTi support, you decided that Acid won't be a simple loop tool anymore in a way. Which means that you spent time and money embedding a technology. Which was a "good move" finally. That's what i call a "drastic" change. You made a step foward to nowdays software sequencer's standard.<< I disagree. Adding VSTi support fit in directly with the direction of MIDI in ACID. It provides a "virtual" MIDI device. Since hardware type MIDI is being pushed aside in some ways by the virtual synth, it made sense to provide the alternative for ACID's MIDI looping features. It was not a drastic change, but just a logical step forward. It didn't change the looping/painting of media model that ACID has always had. >>What i'm afraid of, is that you decide to keep this baby out of the PC Software Sequencer race, just to stick to what it was always meant to be : a loop tool.<< Again, right now ACID is not a sequencer in the traditional sense. We incorporated MIDI editing because there was no simple MIDI editor like Sound Forge to permit the creation of MIDI "loops". We don't provide a audio editor in ACID because we have Forge available as tool. The OPT technology permited us to provide MIDI editors. Whether ACID becomes a more DAW like app remains to be seen. We have heard the requests and the needs of both sides of the user base for ACID. ACID will always move forward. I can't comment on the specifics of what that will be for ACID 5 or further. Peter
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: Jessariah Date:12/9/2003 6:47:52 AM I'm with Spirit. I think the MORE you "add" to Acid's features list, the more watered down it becomes. I use Acid as a loop-based composing tool. That's it. I go elsewhere for MIDI (and even to edit/"chop" loops). I'll buy any Acid upgrade that improves on stretching, transposing, etc. I won't pay for improved features that I don't use to begin with. I know people gave Maruuk a hard time in here last year, but I think he was right -- give Acid Rewire, dump the rest of the add-ons, and let people "add their own extras."
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: Iacobus Date:12/9/2003 10:22:30 AM Wasn't it Maruuk who wanted ACID to be more of an "all-in-one" app? Anyway, I'm definitely on the side of "letting ACID be ACID." Any new features should fit into ACID's existing paradigm, not the other way around. For example, you couldn't even playback MIDI tracks in projects before ACID Pro 3.0 came out; the only MIDI feature was MIDI sync. Since ACID is a looping tool, the logical step, as Peter mentioned, was to provide a way to work with MIDI so that users could create MIDI-based loops or just bring in a MIDI track to score along with. Iacobus ------- RodelWorks - Original Music for the Unafraid mD's ACIDplanet Page
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: xxFT13xx Date:12/9/2003 10:41:54 AM i gotta agree with mD on that one. dont totally redesign AP, just add to what is already there. dont ruin what is already a KILLER, MUST HAVE app. -Sin
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: DKeenum Date:12/9/2003 12:46:27 PM The more I've thought about it, I have to agree.
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: jtxx000 Date:12/9/2003 2:14:39 PM I think that more MIDI stuff would be great. Another feature I would really like to see is VST effects.
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: pwppch Date:12/9/2003 5:20:33 PM I see this request for VST FX a lot. Why is this important? We support DX. All the major FX are available in DX. Again, the VST to DX wrappers do everything that we would would have to do to make it all work. The wrappers add little if any overhead and have already solved the problems with all the shareware/freeware plugs out there. Peter
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: Jessariah Date:12/9/2003 8:35:05 PM I think I was misunderstood. I'm not for all the "extras." Focus on what makes Acid "Acid" - and not how to make it more like other apps. Those who say, "why can't I have more than one sound on a track in Acid," don't get what Acid is about. Acid (as far as I'm concerned) was never meant to "do it all." To try and make it that way because some people want to to only work in one app is a mistake. Most of us who use these apps to make a living use MORE THAN ONE. Some say "limited," I say "specialized." JMHO
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: DJ_Don Date:12/9/2003 9:17:20 PM Sorry, but I've got to butt in here and disagree. Look at what was brought into Acid when it went from 3.0 to 4.0. Acid as just a looping tool? Then why would they bring in 5.1 surround capabilities? Why would they bother adding the additional MIDI capabilities that they did beyond 3.0? They could give Acid a MIDI sequencer that would make any Sonar/Logic/Cubase user green with envy and still keep Acid the BEST looping software on the planet (which it certainly is). As long as you can drag files from the media pool into Acid and paint them across the screen, Acid is still doing it's core job. I REALLY hope they give Acid a kick-ass MIDI sequencer and multitrack recording capabilities, because I know that no matter how advanced they take it, a new user will still be able to paint wave files across the screen and make music within 10 minutes (or less) of powering up the software. The features that are being begged for in this forum are not meant to take away from Acid's core compitency, they are simply meant to add to it. Sony needs to look not at what Acid IS, but look at what Acid DOES (or rather what its users are doing with it). I have done TONS of work in Acid that doesn't simply sound like loops being painted across a screen, although loops are a big part of what I do. And yes, I struggle along with the clunky sequencer for now, in the hopes that in 5.0 I will not be wishing Acid did so much of the things I currently wish it would do. Why not make Acid an all-in-one DAW? The better mousetrap was made by Sonic Foundry years ago. Now Sony has the opportunity to take this amazing program to the next level without sacrificing one bit of what makes Acid so great in the first place. As long as it is stable (which I realize is far easier said than done) give Acid all the power you can. I don't WANT to worry about "Rewiring" Acid to anything. I just want to boot it up and make music without feeling the need to go anywhere else (except to Sound Forge or CD Architect, which serve different functions entirely). Keep up the great work Sony. For what it's worth, I'm a loyal user/fan of your products, and I can't wait to see what's in store in 5.0. Sorry for such a long post. Gotta go--it's past my bedtime. :o) Peace.
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: Zacchino Date:12/10/2003 1:25:22 AM Amen (Dj Don). That's what i wanted to reply ! At least we're two thinking the same way.
Subject:RE: It's up to you guys... AP's future Reply by: jtxx000 Date:12/10/2003 2:16:42 PM All major effects may be DirectX, but most free effects are VST. Plus, you can use SynthEdit to make your own VST effects without programming. The only good usable wrapper I've seen is Cakewalk's, and its $60. What I want to know is should I buy it, or will Acid 5 have this feature.

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