Mixed field order not working

duckworth wrote on 7/28/2003, 9:30 AM

I currently have a 4.0c project consisting of an mpeg video clip and a DV clip, both interlaced NTSC, 720x480. The mpeg clip is recognized as being top-field first when i right click on it and view its media properties, and the DV is correctly labeled bottom field first in its media properties. When I set the Project properties to interlaced, bottom field first and render it to mpeg 2 the mpeg source material is messed up and jittery and the DV portion is fine. When I set the project properties to interlaced, upper-field first it is the opposite with the mpeg source material being fine and the DV portion messed up and jittery. According to the threads I've read here, Vegas should take care of the rendered output as long as it is correctly identified in it's media properties correctly? Is there something I am missing, or is this the expected behavior?

Comments

RBartlett wrote on 7/28/2003, 9:44 AM

You would expect Vegas 4.0c to get this right.

You can check the fielding is truly as you've tried to render with using TMPGEnc.

Drop your respective sources into the Tsunami Encoder, one at a time:

go to settings -> Advanced and double click on the "Deinterlace"
to check the field order. Click the combo "Method" and select
"Even-Odd field (field)", and go to some area with action. Advance a few
fields manually, and if it appears to bounce a bit back and forth, the field
setting is incorrect within the current TMPGEnc profile. This method works for just about anything that doesn't switch field orders mid file. Don't forget to uncheck "Deinterlace" when done if you plan to use TMPGEnc further.

Matching Vegas to what you establish in TMPGEnc - should save you having made a mistake. If you've qualified the field order and you've still got a problem - maybe Vegas has a fault.

You could try to render just a portion of each section and swap the fielding blindly.
Lastly, if you have a Matrox G series card, the TV-out fielding is sometimes wrong without the more recent driver and dual-head settings being fiddled with. Other targets are usually OK...

duckworth wrote on 7/28/2003, 10:09 AM

I have verified the fielding of the source files. I have even tried swapping the field orders in their media properties in Vegas with no success. As of now I can't mix both types in the same project.

The mpeg files are from my Sony DCR-IP5 and are micromv converted using mmv2mpg and the DV are from a DCR-TRV33 captured in Vegas.

RBartlett wrote on 7/28/2003, 10:30 AM

You'd expect this to be a fault then.

Are the developers on holday - haven't seen many Sonic Foundry motifs on the posts lately?

I'd recommend rendering the footage of just one type, probably the shorter of the two, to a different codec. Alternatively frame-serve the footage from TMPGEnc/VFAPI and swap it at that part of the workflow.

If this is a fault with 4.0c - it should be sorted ASAP. Especially as you have two Sony cameras involved!

When you say you've verified the field dominance of the source. Have you done this with a tool that tells you about the format, or actually done something like what I described. I realise your sanity check is that Vegas hasn't changed when you swap the dominance of the clip around. You've clearly been looking to either break it all, or fix it all in your selection.

(if frame-serving or re-rendering isn't possible - you might manage to fox Vegas by setting the clips to be progressive on the timeline, but render out using an interleaved format with a common dominance throughout).

Grazie wrote on 7/28/2003, 11:05 AM

RB . .

. . http://www.sonicfoundry.com/news/ShowRelease.asp?ReleaseID=564&CatID=

Could this be why?

Grazie

RBartlett wrote on 7/29/2003, 4:28 AM

I saw Dr Dropout on Cow - he ~just~ mentioned a 4.0d issue "soon". I feel better on both the message being there and the news. Dr Dropout being SoFo staff.

Be interesting if duckworth's problem is a bug. I have memory of putting some uncompressed NTSC 720x486 [I think] footage alongside PAL DV and seeing a similar problem to duckworths. I only had the one clip so swapped the field dominance on the uncompressed 4:2:2 insert piece.

Ahoy - Sonic Foundry - what goes on with your field dominance in 4.0c - is it different in 4.0d?

SonyDennis wrote on 8/1/2003, 10:01 AM

I just tried this in 4.0c and it works perfectly. Make sure your render quality is set to Good or Best, otherwise deinterlacing and field rendering (reinterlacing) will not occur. Make sure you didn't change your (project property) Deinterlace method from Blend Fields (or Interpolate Fields).
///d@