VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround -ACID Product Family

Subject:VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround Posted by: gunhed Date:7/21/2003 9:50:34 PM Please confirm: I upgraded to the newest and greatest 4.0e patch, and I believe I have found a bug. I'm using Windows Classic Wave driver and have found that the VSTi synths pay absolutely no attention to the volume envelopes in the Bus Traks view (accessed with the U key) specifically in a 5.1 Surround project. With a non-surround project the volume envelopes behave as expected.
Subject:RE: VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround Reply by: SonicJG Date:7/22/2003 9:52:15 AM gunhed- From following your description, this does not reproduce for me. Which VSTi(s) are you using, and which audio card? FWIW, audio card/driver shouldn't make any difference. Please supply as detailed of a description of what you're doing/seeing as possible. Thanks, Joel
Subject:RE: VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround Reply by: gunhed Date:7/22/2003 10:18:37 AM I'm using the following hardware / software: Windows XP Home / DirectX 9.0a / Acid Pro 4.0e Dell Dimension 8200, P4 at 2.53 GHz, 512 Megs RAM Santa Cruz (5.1 channel THX) DSP sound card nVidia GeForce4 Ti 4200 APG video card with 64 Meg I'm having the envelope problem only in surround projects with the WCW driver (I have, of course, independently assigned the front, rear, and 5/6 channels appropriately). I have also noticed that the surround keyframes are not working, either. Non-VSTi tracks (such as one-shot WAVs) function as expected. When I switch to the Direct Sound Surround Mapper, the volume envelopes function correctly on VSTi tracks (but the sound quality is comparatively poor, IMHO). I have completely uninstalled and reinstalled Acid 4.0e (from the update file, not the CD), but the problem persists. I did not have this problem with 4.0b.
Subject:RE: VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround Reply by: gunhed Date:7/22/2003 7:29:51 PM More info (I hope this might help the programmers): I've played around with the issue and learned a little more about Acid 4.0e's behavior. I started a new surround project an inserted a VSTi synth and drew a few notes into the piano roll. I inserted a volume envelope onto the bus view screen and added a single point midway. What I found was that I could ever so slightly affect the volume at the added point, but it would never fully mute when dropped to -inf. At this point, I discovered that when I adjusted the initial volume point (to the far right), the overall volume was affected, even past the fixed point I added. This should not happen. For example: Say the initial point, A, is set to 0 dB, and my added point, B, is located 2 measures down and set to -inf. In playing the score, the volume only slightly decreases as it reaches B. If I change the scenario by setting A to -inf and B to 0 dB and play it back, I hear complete silence. It seems almost as if the playback volume for the track is equal to the initial volume setting and only slightly influenced by progressive points along the way. The volume is "stuck" where the initial playback is begun. Additionally, if I place the playback cursor at a location where the volume is at an "intermediate" level, the synth will play at that that volume and only slightly waver as before. Whatever the starting volume from the playback is where the volume gets "stuck." By the way, I have also tested with surround keyframes, and the same "stuck" issues occurs.
Subject:Surround fixed in 4.0f Reply by: gunhed Date:12/6/2003 9:00:57 PM I finally went to check for an update, and downloaded the Acid Pro 4.0f update. The release notes specifically mention the type of problem I was having, and, believe it or not, it has corrected the problem!!! Kudos go to the programming team on that release! Thank you, thank you!

Subject:VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround

Posted by: gunhed

Date:7/21/2003 9:50:34 PM

Please confirm:

I upgraded to the newest and greatest 4.0e patch, and I believe I have found a bug. I'm using Windows Classic Wave driver and have found that the VSTi synths pay absolutely no attention to the volume envelopes in the Bus Traks view (accessed with the U key) specifically in a 5.1 Surround project. With a non-surround project the volume envelopes behave as expected.

Subject:RE: VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround

Reply by: SonicJG

Date:7/22/2003 9:52:15 AM

gunhed-

From following your description, this does not reproduce for me. Which VSTi(s) are you using, and which audio card? FWIW, audio card/driver shouldn't make any difference.

Please supply as detailed of a description of what you're doing/seeing as possible.

Thanks,
Joel

Subject:RE: VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround

Reply by: gunhed

Date:7/22/2003 10:18:37 AM

I'm using the following hardware / software:

Windows XP Home / DirectX 9.0a / Acid Pro 4.0e
Dell Dimension 8200, P4 at 2.53 GHz, 512 Megs RAM
Santa Cruz (5.1 channel THX) DSP sound card
nVidia GeForce4 Ti 4200 APG video card with 64 Meg

I'm having the envelope problem only in surround projects with the WCW driver (I have, of course, independently assigned the front, rear, and 5/6 channels appropriately). I have also noticed that the surround keyframes are not working, either. Non-VSTi tracks (such as one-shot WAVs) function as expected. When I switch to the Direct Sound Surround Mapper, the volume envelopes function correctly on VSTi tracks (but the sound quality is comparatively poor, IMHO). I have completely uninstalled and reinstalled Acid 4.0e (from the update file, not the CD), but the problem persists. I did not have this problem with 4.0b.

Subject:RE: VSTi Envelope Problems with Acid 4.0e and surround

Reply by: gunhed

Date:7/22/2003 7:29:51 PM

More info (I hope this might help the programmers):

I've played around with the issue and learned a little more about Acid 4.0e's behavior. I started a new surround project an inserted a VSTi synth and drew a few notes into the piano roll. I inserted a volume envelope onto the bus view screen and added a single point midway. What I found was that I could ever so slightly affect the volume at the added point, but it would never fully mute when dropped to -inf. At this point, I discovered that when I adjusted the initial volume point (to the far right), the overall volume was affected, even past the fixed point I added. This should not happen.

For example: Say the initial point, A, is set to 0 dB, and my added point, B, is located 2 measures down and set to -inf. In playing the score, the volume only slightly decreases as it reaches B. If I change the scenario by setting A to -inf and B to 0 dB and play it back, I hear complete silence. It seems almost as if the playback volume for the track is equal to the initial volume setting and only slightly influenced by progressive points along the way. The volume is "stuck" where the initial playback is begun.

Additionally, if I place the playback cursor at a location where the volume is at an "intermediate" level, the synth will play at that that volume and only slightly waver as before. Whatever the starting volume from the playback is where the volume gets "stuck."

By the way, I have also tested with surround keyframes, and the same "stuck" issues occurs.

Subject:Surround fixed in 4.0f

Reply by: gunhed

Date:12/6/2003 9:00:57 PM

I finally went to check for an update, and downloaded the Acid Pro 4.0f update. The release notes specifically mention the type of problem I was having, and, believe it or not, it has corrected the problem!!!

Kudos go to the programming team on that release!
Thank you, thank you!