Subject:How do you use Chainer with Acid?

Posted by: L25

Date:6/28/2003 11:29:37 AM

I just downloaded the demo and did a sofo search. I see I can create a new midi track, insert a soft synth, select chainer, then I can stack a bunch of soft synths to one track. Without chainer, you would duplicate midi tracks and select a different soft synth.

What is a workflow using chainer with acid, Any Chainer users care to reply.

Thanks,

Jeff

Subject:RE: How do you use Chainer with Acid?

Reply by: dkistner

Date:6/28/2003 6:30:39 PM

Jeff, because I use Chainer outside of Acid to record dry individual voice lines (via SoFo's midi router out from my scoring program and into Chainer) to wave files first, which I then pull into Acid for mixing work, I'm only speculating here. But knowing how Chainer works, I expect this could work.

Chainer allows for setting your midi-in for each slot to either specific channels 1 to 16 or to All. So I would think it would be possible in Acid to split a midi track into separate channels using Chainer--say, as I use it (so I can remember what I'm doing), the first 8 channels in Chainer's slots 1 through 8, then another instance of Chainer in slot 9 that holds channels 9 through 16--and use a different VSTi treatment for each one. But this, of course, is going to be cpu-intensive if you're running Acid at the same time. This is why I do it the way I do it, outside of Acid to get the dry waves recorded first.

I put a VSTi followed by an instance of Inspector in each channel (Chainer slot configured as above) so I can do spectral analysis on the individual voice lines; maybe precede Inspector with a filter if I want to do a little filtering before it goes into Acid; and record each channel out simultaneously to 32-bit-float wave files using Channel Grabber 2. But since Chainer also runs as a standalone host, I prefer to get the dry waves recorded out to audio first, then do the filtering and effects work in Acid directly to the waves. It just works more efficiently, workflow-wise, for me to do it this way because I can split recording out from mixing and always have a bone-dry recording preserved, which gives me a little more courage when I'm mixing.

I don't know if, in VSTi mode, Chainer allows you to have all the Inspector instances (and CG2 instances) open at once as it does when used standalone. The former is helpful in that you can freeze all of Inspector's analysis windows simply by soloing, say, slot 10 (into which I usually load the drum track, where I also put my CG2 midi note recording triggers). The latter is helpful in that you have to have each CG2 window open in order for file recording for each one to turn on and off at the same time.

That probably doesn't make sense just reading about it, but if you get your hands on it and try it, you'll see how great it works. Using the above method of splitting out channels, you can accomplish just about anything.

Subject:So far I use the demo as a multi-timbral sound module.

Reply by: groovewerx

Date:6/29/2003 6:07:13 AM

I have the audio routed out of an aux pair on my sound card and being fed in to my mixer to be blended with my harware and effects, back into the sound card.

I first load up the channels with synths that support program change messages. That way I can switch between patches with my Triton. I can also adjust envelopes and other things with the knobs, sliders and touchscreen. I add other softsynths once Ive got the initial setup dialed in.

After gathering the patches I launch a drum loop in Acid Music and record the live perfomance of my playing and tweaking the knobs.

Once I've captured a "keeper", I stop the deck and render it as a new track before removing the original from the song. Then I change the MIDI channel and record the next instrument and so on.

Because I use Acid Music, I have to gather and render all the "keepers" so I can mix and effect them in Cubase. (I always record "dry" as possible. That way it will be easier to add effects than remove them).

In Cubase I build a sequence around the Acid takes + incorporate all the ReWire devices, plugins, and effects in my arsenal.

I usually render that down to a temporay 2-track and open it in Acid to add the killer synth effects with Chainer. This is also when I record bass, guitar, hand percussion, vocal and other mic'ed sources.

Once thats done, I edit and render the new tracks then open them in the Cubase song for mixing and final edits.

From there it all gets rendered to 2-track and goes to WaveLab for mastering.

I know it sounds like alot of moving between apps but it took a year to develop a flow that works best for me. And now that I have Chainer, it works even better.



dkistner: I saw you have a VSTi. What is the name of it?

Subject:RE: How do you use Chainer with Acid?

Reply by: dkistner

Date:6/29/2003 7:33:40 AM

You mean Hockinger's Ultradia SE VSTi? That's specifically for creating brainwave entrainments. If you're interested in that kind of thing, you can get it at either kvr (in the Instruments section) or at www.ultradia.org. There's a standalone version, too, that's a little more powerful. They're both free.

Subject:RE: So far I use the demo as a multi-timbral sound module.

Reply by: Spy

Date:7/1/2003 5:11:37 AM

"Because I use Acid Music, I have to gather and render all the "keepers" so I can mix and effect them in Cubase. (I always record "dry" as possible. That way it will be easier to add effects than remove them)."

Greetings groovewerx,

Just out of curiousity, why don't you record directly into Cubase? Do you find Acid superior in terms of quality or ease of use?

The reason I'm asking is because I have Cubase (VST and SX) too. However, I've found both the quality of recordings (audio) and the 'usability' much better (for me) in Acid (Pro 4.0d) than in Cubase, though SX is again (for me) much better in both respects than VST.

Anyway, if I'm not being too nosey, I'd be interested to find out your views.





One Love, Spy!

Subject:RE: So far I use the demo as a multi-timbral sound module.

Reply by: groovewerx

Date:7/1/2003 6:09:23 PM

Spy:

For me its faster to use Acid to capture live single tracks at the spur of the moment because it automatically moves me on to the next track when I press record. In Cubase, the extra steps can impede a groove that has just popped into my head.
If I have organized and planned out a recording session, Cubase is my first choice.

Acid is much better when it comes to chopping and repeating parts because of its quick -fade and wave drawing structure. But for quality comparison, Cubase gives a more accurate representation of my sound without coloring it as Acid does. Cubase is far superior when it comes to mixing and adding effects as well.

If clean/crisp sound is what you want, use Cubase. If warm/smooth sound is more to your liking, use Acid.

Both have a home in my studio.