Vegas 4.0 and 5.1 Mixing with Delta 66 -AC-3 Encoder

Subject:Vegas 4.0 and 5.1 Mixing with Delta 66 Posted by: Vocalpoint Date:5/22/2003 1:57:41 PM All, I am beginning to explore mixing in 5.1 surround in my home studio. I am using Vegas 4.0c with the AC-3 decoder with my M-Audio Delta 66. My questions are these: 1. After I set up a 5.1 mix in Vegas - Is it possible to use the Vegas 4.0/AC-3 combo to send a true 5.1 digital stream to the SPDIF output on my Delta 66 card and then feed that stream to an external decoder? 2. Is anyone mixing in 5.1 surround on a pro-sumer set of speakers like Klipsch Promedia or the Logitech Z-680's? Like many I have talked to - going the true "pro" route can get very pricey to add more speakers into the mix. My main studio monitors are the Event 20/20 BAS. It has been suggested that if I wanted to do 5.1 like the "pros" way, I should add 3 additional Event PS-6 speakers for my rears and center plus the 20/20/12 subwoofer but this is going to run over 2000.00CDN very quick. Plus I may need a new audio interface (like a Delta 1010) and maybe a new hardware mixer as well. While not considered "pro" by most, The Promedia's or the Z-680's run between $450.00 to $699.00CDN for the entire speaker array and I feel this might be a good way to get a taste of 5.1 mixing without breaking the bank. I do of course have reservations about how these cheaper systems would "color" the mix compared to a very flat response speaker like the 20/20BAS 3. If you are mixing 5.1 in Vegas in any way (pro, consumer, whatever shape or form) - would you be willing to share your hardware and software and how you connected it all to get reasonable 5.1? Appreciate the time, Cheers, Cuzin B
Subject:RE: Vegas 4.0 and 5.1 Mixing with Delta 66 Reply by: Pesie Date:5/22/2003 2:16:32 PM I'm not an expert but perhaps you find some clues in my experiences: a) As far as I know it's not possible to have a direct 5.1 digital monitoring via the SPIF output of a soundcard. Unless there exists a soundcard that can encode the 6 channels from Vegas directly/realtime/on the fly to while playing the timeline. Such a soundcard requires a built-in Dolby encoder. b) If you want to monitor your surround sound while working in the timeline, you need a soundcard that has drivers (i.e. ASIO) that make the seperate outputs available in the speaker setup section of Vegas (L+R front, L+R rear, Center+Subwoofer). Connect the soundcard outputs to a mixer or a Dolby Digital receiver with appropiate 6 inputs (for 5.1) and hear your sound via the mixer/receiver with 6 speakers. c) I have a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz soundcard (Dell OEM). After loading other drivers, I was able to route the Vegas speaker-setup to the different directions. However, I've got a good quality Altec Lansing 4.1 surround speaker setup, and somehow the combination of the TB card and these speakers don't work quite good. I don't think it's a Vegas problem. I gave up working this way (because it also changed the way the soundcard works in other programs in a way I disliked). So my TB card is now back in it's original mode, which means: using the spdif output to the 4.1 setup and not able to monitor the rear/center/subwoofer speakers as I would like while mixing in Vegas. But after some testing, I managed to learn myself how to use the surround mixing sliders to make things sound great in surround. And when I'm not sure about a part of the audio mix, I do a quick AC3 render of that part, which mostly takes a couple of seconds to process. And then I check this rendered AC3 file with PowerDVD via the TB/4.1 setup to listen to the surround mix. Hope this is of any help., Peter Sieben

Subject:Vegas 4.0 and 5.1 Mixing with Delta 66

Posted by: Vocalpoint

Date:5/22/2003 1:57:41 PM

All,

I am beginning to explore mixing in 5.1 surround in my home studio. I am using Vegas 4.0c with the AC-3 decoder with my M-Audio Delta 66. My questions are these:

1. After I set up a 5.1 mix in Vegas - Is it possible to use the Vegas 4.0/AC-3 combo to send a true 5.1 digital stream to the SPDIF output on my Delta 66 card and then feed that stream to an external decoder?

2. Is anyone mixing in 5.1 surround on a pro-sumer set of speakers like Klipsch Promedia or the Logitech Z-680's?

Like many I have talked to - going the true "pro" route can get very pricey to add more speakers into the mix. My main studio monitors are the Event 20/20 BAS. It has been suggested that if I wanted to do 5.1 like the "pros" way, I should add 3 additional Event PS-6 speakers for my rears and center plus the 20/20/12 subwoofer but this is going to run over 2000.00CDN very quick. Plus I may need a new audio interface (like a Delta 1010) and maybe a new hardware mixer as well.

While not considered "pro" by most, The Promedia's or the Z-680's run between $450.00 to $699.00CDN for the entire speaker array and I feel this might be a good way to get a taste of 5.1 mixing without breaking the bank. I do of course have reservations about how these cheaper systems would "color" the mix compared to a very flat response speaker like the 20/20BAS

3. If you are mixing 5.1 in Vegas in any way (pro, consumer, whatever shape or form) - would you be willing to share your hardware and software and how you connected it all to get reasonable 5.1?

Appreciate the time,

Cheers,

Cuzin B

Subject:RE: Vegas 4.0 and 5.1 Mixing with Delta 66

Reply by: Pesie

Date:5/22/2003 2:16:32 PM

I'm not an expert but perhaps you find some clues in my experiences:

a) As far as I know it's not possible to have a direct 5.1 digital monitoring via the SPIF output of a soundcard. Unless there exists a soundcard that can encode the 6 channels from Vegas directly/realtime/on the fly to while playing the timeline. Such a soundcard requires a built-in Dolby encoder.

b) If you want to monitor your surround sound while working in the timeline, you need a soundcard that has drivers (i.e. ASIO) that make the seperate outputs available in the speaker setup section of Vegas (L+R front, L+R rear, Center+Subwoofer). Connect the soundcard outputs to a mixer or a Dolby Digital receiver with appropiate 6 inputs (for 5.1) and hear your sound via the mixer/receiver with 6 speakers.

c) I have a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz soundcard (Dell OEM). After loading other drivers, I was able to route the Vegas speaker-setup to the different directions. However, I've got a good quality Altec Lansing 4.1 surround speaker setup, and somehow the combination of the TB card and these speakers don't work quite good. I don't think it's a Vegas problem.
I gave up working this way (because it also changed the way the soundcard works in other programs in a way I disliked). So my TB card is now back in it's original mode, which means: using the spdif output to the 4.1 setup and not able to monitor the rear/center/subwoofer speakers as I would like while mixing in Vegas. But after some testing, I managed to learn myself how to use the surround mixing sliders to make things sound great in surround. And when I'm not sure about a part of the audio mix, I do a quick AC3 render of that part, which mostly takes a couple of seconds to process. And then I check this rendered AC3 file with PowerDVD via the TB/4.1 setup to listen to the surround mix.

Hope this is of any help.,

Peter Sieben