Subject:Normalize more than once?

Posted by: Hummingbird

Date:12/9/2002 11:40:36 AM

If you normalize a file, then apply one of the acoustic mirror environments, the overall level of the file drops. Does normalizing again cause any unpleasant side-effects?

Is it better to apply acoustic mirror before normalizing?

Thanks -

Hummingbird

Subject:RE: Normalize more than once?

Reply by: MJhig

Date:12/9/2002 2:35:42 PM

In Accoustic Mirror you have both "Dry" and "Wet" level faders, adjust you volume there.

It's better to keep the number of times you process data to a minimum.

MJ

Subject:RE: Normalize more than once?

Reply by: Doug_Marshall

Date:12/9/2002 6:36:22 PM

Unless there is some other compelling reason it might be best to normalize the file as the last processing you do to it. That way you will only need to do it once.

Subject:RE: Normalize more than once?

Reply by: Hummingbird

Date:12/11/2002 5:45:14 PM

Thanks for the replies, but the question still remains - "does normalizing more than once cause undesirable artifacts"? I am under the impression that "non-destructive editing" is precisely that - "non-destructive." What harm is done by normalizing more than once?

Thanks -

Subject:RE: Normalize more than once?

Reply by: Chienworks

Date:12/12/2002 7:08:20 AM

Hummingbird, every process you do to a file introduces artifacts. The more processing you do, the more artifacts you will have. Therefore, you should process as little as possible. (Suggestion to SonicFoundry ... add a checkbox for "Normalize result" to most every process/effect. That way we can auto-normalize on the last process we do and avoid one more processing step.)

Non-destructive editing means that the source file isn't being changed during the editing process. The changes are being incorporated into either a new temporary file, or written to the new output file when saved. This new file has been very much "destructed" by the processing. If you save the new output over the same filename as the original source, then you now have a destructed version and have lost the non-destructed original.

Subject:RE: Normalize more than once?

Reply by: Rednroll

Date:12/12/2002 9:29:57 AM

"(Suggestion to SonicFoundry ... add a checkbox for "Normalize result" to most every process/effect. That way we can auto-normalize on the last process we do and avoid one more processing step.)"

This would not elliminate 1 more processing step, and probably create problems where users would be complaining about distortion, because they accidentally left the check box on, from the previous use of the plugin and on this particular use it is in the middle of a processing chain. It would do the effect and then normalize, if you had an autonormalize check box. Thus you still have 2 steps happening. Remember, also that although normalizing should be the last processing done to the file, that one man's poison is another man's (fill in the blank)......oh well forgot that proverb. Anyways, what I'm trying to say is sometimes degredation of audio is used to create special effects, and in the case of normalizing, it should be done only once to keep the audio precision good, but someone might be using that degredation to create a particular sound. In many causes I will convert a file to 8 bit resolution and do some processing on that and then convert it back to 16/24 bit resolution, to create a grainy sounding FX.

To the original post, as already stated. Normalizing should be done only once as the last step of processing. Normalizing is a process and any process will create artifacts. A lot of mastering engineers will do their mastering process and try to get the level as close to 0dB without clipping, and avoid the normalizing process all together, just so they can elliminate 1 more step of processing. If you have a file already peaking at -0.2 dB level, normalizing can be more harmful than beneficial.

red