Subject:Turntables and ACID

Posted by: DjXSoundz

Date:11/23/2002 6:07:14 PM

Heh, i've called myself a DJ for sometime now, and i dont have any turntables yet. Of course i've used the scratch "pads" on my djx and d2, but not really a turntable. I've made my own ACID loops with my synth soundmodules, grooveboxes, bass guitar, drum machines ....all that. But i was thinkin i'd add some flavor and add in some scrathes u know? So i need a turntable thats under $200 (probably direct-drive) and is good for scratching, needs a noise-free output cuz i'm gonna use it with acid. I dont really care about S/PDIF outputs, thats expensive anyways. This is the wrong form to ask about DJ gear, i know but ur the only one that i know who is reliable.

any ideas?

Thanks
DJ XSOUNDZ

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: groovewerx

Date:11/24/2002 9:46:41 AM

The content of this message was deleted by the owner.

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: coolout

Date:11/24/2002 2:44:03 PM

this is the same prob i had a couple of years ago...i wanted to sharpen my scratches and add them to my music but didn't want to pay $1000 for a good pair of decks.

no disrespect to groovewerx but stay the hell away from the lower end gemini stuff.

if you just want to add cuts and scratches to your recordings there is a way to do it on the cheap.

go with the stanton products for about $150 for the turntable and about $150-200 for the mixer.

their belt drive turntables are the best cheap ones out there. with the straight arm they don't skip at all and the torque is better than most cheap direct drive turntables. plus they come with a 500AL scratch needle already mounted on the headshell.

if they're so great then why are they so cheap you may ask?

there's no quartz lock so the pitch drifts during mixing (that sucks) and the torque (startup time when you start the record or let go of the record) isn't near a $400-500 dollar turntable (tech 1200, vestax, or the new numark ttx) plus they're made of plastic so they're not durable to gig with.

but if you just want to scratch they're great.

also look into their mixers. the ones with the "focus fader" have a razor sharp cutoff so it's really easy to do popular scratches like the "crab" and the "flare". the crossfader is so smooth you can blow it from one side to the next, plus they're usually $75-100 bucks cheaper than a good vestax.

you can get one turntable and a mixer for about $300 bucks total.

if you still have doubt check out the "straight Up Turntable Buying Guide" at www.turntablelab.com

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: DjXSoundz

Date:11/24/2002 7:03:07 PM

I dont need a DJ mixer because i only want one turntable. I can jus plug into my recording mixer. I'm not gonna gig with it much anyways. Belt Drive from santon...i thought i was looking at a Direct drive on from them for $150...anyways is belt drive good enough for some basic scratching?

thanks
DJ XSoundz

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: Chienworks

Date:11/24/2002 8:06:52 PM

Your recording mixer may or may not have a turntable input. If it doesn't, then it won't apply the proper RIAA equalization curve to the signal. Of course, if you're dealing with scratching, this may not matter. If you were archiving your precious vinyl recordings to CDs then it would make a huge difference.

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: coolout

Date:11/24/2002 9:33:12 PM

yes a belt drive stanton can be used for scratching and you NEED a mixer.

Chienworks is correct that a turntable needs to be pre-amped to line level to be recorded.

but more importantly...

the majority of scratches above the basic "baby" scratch (wocka, wocka) utilize the timing of the fader.

the actual rhythm of the fader cutting in and out is the most important thing in turntablism in general. every dj knows this. it's what separates a "transform" from a "flare" from a "chirp or stab" from a "crab" and so on and so on and so on...

if you're not really interested in learning to scratch and you just want a basic "baby" scratch as a sound effect there's various software and loops that can emulate that sound. you don't need to invest in a turntable for that.

you have to understand that the turntable is an instrument that takes as much learning and practice as any other instrument.

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: groovewerx

Date:11/25/2002 8:06:48 AM

The content of this message was deleted by the owner.

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: DjXSoundz

Date:11/25/2002 6:19:12 PM

Ok, i have mic preamps, and some channels with lots of gain on my mixer, so if the turntable puts out a low signal I can always boost it....but Cheinworks mentions RIAA equalization....do i need that, and can i jus use a 30 band (or acid plug-in) to emulate that. I'm kind of understanding the mixer deal...will a cheap $60 one with a fader do?? I thought i had it planned out ....a $150 Santon S58-30 direct driveone..now i need a mixer just for scratching???

any help will do, thanks so far
DJ XSOUNDZ

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: Chienworks

Date:11/25/2002 6:59:20 PM

If you're not actually mixing two turntables together, you don't need a mixer (although you might eventually find it useful for other things). You can probably pick up a phono preamp for about $30 or $40 that converts the phono cartridge's output to a line level signal complete with RIAA EQ correction.

If you want to go dirt cheap, you can connect a ceramic cartridge directly to the line input on your sound card, or a magnetic cartridge directly to the mic input. The eq may be off a lot, but can be corrected somewhat with an EQ plugin. Keep in mind that the EQ plugin won't be realtime, but will be applied after recording. Since you want this for scratching rather than listening to music, it may very well be good enough. Hey, it might even become your signature sound! ;)

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: ra

Date:11/25/2002 7:22:09 PM

Figure out what a scratch dj/ turntablist does before you decide to incorporate that art into yours. It'll make more sense then. otherwise, use a sampler cause without a crossfader, your scratches will sound weak.
sorry.

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: asopaque

Date:11/25/2002 7:33:51 PM

also, if you are looking to go direct, but need something to preamp the phono input, maybe check out Electrix EQKiller, or Filter Queen. Electrix went out of business recently, and they were blowing these units out at Guitar Center for about $50.

You may be able to pick one up still at around that price. You will get either a cool eq/frequency killer or a great filter box, and they both have pretty nice phono preamps in them.

just a thought.

rich

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: coolout

Date:11/25/2002 7:38:14 PM

DjXSoundz- i forgot to tell you the turntable also has to be grounded. there's usually a wire running alongside the phono plug you have to connect to the mixer. if not you get this nasty hum. my advice would be to go with a stanton mixer @ $150-200 or the gemini umx series are being closed out and are dirt cheap at about $150 less that normal. the umx has VCA crossfaders so they should be smooth and have a respectable cutoff.


Groovewerx- i meant no disrespect. it's just that the stanton lower-end products are superior to the lower-end gemini stuff in my opinion and also any review you read online.

i actually love gemini as a company and really wanted to give them my cash and support. the employees are really cool people. every year at NAMM they remember me, come out to hear me play, and offer to hook me up with stuff even though i'm just a local guy, but years ago when i wanted to work more on just my scratches and didn't want to spend $1000 bucks on tech 1200s, stanton offered a better product for less money. i still have my stantons and use tech 1200s at my thursday night gig. you don't have to "unlearn" you technique.

And I know you don’t want to compare how old-school we both are.

I too saw D.S.T. perform “rockit” with herbie hancock and started trying to scratch…till my mom slapped me on the back of the head. I think that was 83’

I also programmed my first drum machine (a roland tr-808) while in 7th grade. My upstairs neighbor had nearly every roland drum machine at one time or another, but guys kept breaking in and stealing his gear.

I bought my first drum machine (a TR-606) when I was 14. I worked all summer in a corny job program making $3.35 an hour just to get that box because the legal working age was 15 and it was the only job I could get.

I remember seeing TB-303s in the music stores for $75 bucks around 86’ or 87’, but I thought they sounded corny and never bought one. I could have paid my way through school with those.

I’ve been messin’ with beats and breaks since they were called beats and breaks.

Subject:RE: Turntables and ACID

Reply by: DjXSoundz

Date:11/26/2002 7:16:55 PM

So say a cheap $40-$60 gemeni mixer with a crossfader will do?

o btw chienworks, i've got an external 15-band eq box from alesis for realtime

thanks
DJ XSOUNDZ