Spot the Amateur

Paul_Holmes wrote on 11/11/2002, 7:45 AM

It's funny. When I first started editing video on the computer 3 years ago, I went transition-crazy. Wow! That's cool. Look at what that does. I soon wised up. I recently did an hour and 20 minute wedding video in which I used one special transition, about 5 dissolves and the rest were straight cuts. I was thinking yesterday that the least used tab in my Vegas setup is Transitions. What has really excited me is the knowledge I've gained on this forum through Billy Boy and others about color-correction.

I find that using music or just fade to black sparingly is a much better way to separate sections of a movie. Also I learned a technique (known to all you professionals) of starting the audio of one scene before the finish of the last as a leadin to the next scene. This cues the viewer that something new is coming without a sudden jar.

SonyDennis wrote on 11/11/2002, 8:11 AM

It reminds me of when the Apple LaserWriter came out, some people had to use every font on every page, and complained that there wern't more.
///d@

RichMacDonald wrote on 11/11/2002, 9:07 AM

And what about the pros who insert FX just to "keep the idiots' attention spans" and annoy the rest of us? Is there a special place in hell for knowing better and still acting like an amateur? Or do they just not know any better?
I was watching the "top 100 one hit wonders" on VH1 last week and there were all
these random "glitches" and "pulses" in the middle of interviews for no reason.
And God help us when someone starts tracking all over a still...
And if one more operator "bumps" the damn camera again every 6 seconds I'm going to scream. Ah, but at least tonight is Monday Night Football, where I can see some of the best.

Paul_Holmes wrote on 11/11/2002, 9:32 AM

Which brings up one of my pet peeves, those "handheld" lawyer and drama shows where the camera appears to be programmed by a robot to "randomly" move slightly in the wrong direction and then back again. (Actually this handheld thing appears to be the new in thing these days, and there are some examples of it done well, but I hate it when it gets obvious that they're employing a "technique.")

TorS wrote on 11/11/2002, 10:06 AM

If you're making a documentary and using short bits of a longer interview it makes sense to use transitions or at least make your cuts visible. That way you inform the viewers that a cut has been made.

Otherwise, when you have to cut up a longer shot and don't have anything to overlap the cut with, dissolves are quite elegant. If you're a film fan you may want to use straight cuts. In that case you might want to zoom in a little just before or after the cut.

I agree with the general attitude of this thread: Keep it simple. And I'd like to add: ...and keep you titles readable.

Tor

riredale wrote on 11/11/2002, 5:10 PM

Hey, gang, for the past couple of projects involving my daughter's choir, I have been timing the dissolves with the music. I haven't heard any complaints, but would this be considered professional or overdone?

It's all been one-camera shoots, but I tape multiple performances, and then I have the luxury of splicing together different camera shots. I've learned to carefully sync the various performances to the master track, and then I can split 'n switch with abandon. Syncing involves lining up key parts of a selection using the audio track, and then splitting and stretching (or shrinking) the individual portions until the multiple audio tracks line up perfectly.

Frankly I think it would be simpler to get another cameraman or two and do the multiple camera shots on the same performance, but at least VV3 gives me the option of turning a boring continuous shot into something pretty cool.

As for FX, I have never used anything but cuts and dissolves. On my latest video I ended it by showing a choir kid being reunited with her dad after a week's tour. I take about 3 seconds to slow the video to a freeze as they embrace, and then fade out on that. That's about as exotic as I get. Oh, last year I did a 5-minute sequence of bloopers and outtakes. I brought them in as one would show old-fashioned lantern slides, where they slide in and out from the left. Worked pretty well.

kkolbo wrote on 11/11/2002, 5:52 PM

I don't think effects are bad or good. I do believe that there is more than enough available in VV for the moment and I am sure that there will be more. I would not choose my NLE over a title here and an effect there. With that said, here is my basic philosiphy (not that you asked for it )

I cut a project together. Key word cut. Then I go back and smooooth it out where it needs it with crossfades and the fades to black. At this point I should be able to tell the story with IMPACT. Then I look and if a point my be better made emotionally with a transistion or an effect then I add it. The fact is, I don't find that many places where the impact is increased by the effect rather than distracted. This applies to documentary and stroy telling projects.

Music video, Hip bumpers, intro's and such are often helped with effects and transisitions.

The idea of cuts being professional comes from film. You had to be able to tell the story with just cuts. It was called disciplin. You should still start there and be sure the story is told. Adding effects and transitions add cost. Now days in out NLE environment it adds very little cost, but be sure it ADDS to the story.

My last project was a 50 minute piece with hundreds of edits. It used cuts and crossfades and one effect (slow mo) that lasted 2 seconds.

K

DGates wrote on 11/11/2002, 6:56 PM

Of course the circumstances dictate the editing. I was just watching ESPN Behind the Glory about Brett Hull. Lots of zig-zagging around the photos, glitches and dropped frames, all on purpose of course. But that's the audience. Hockey fans.

I doubt a similar story about Tom Watson, the golfer, would be edited the same way.

However you get the story told best, that's what works.

Silver & Digital wrote on 11/11/2002, 10:05 PM

Maybe it is not a matter of good or bad rather of what is effective and ineffective and what adds and what subtracts.

I often see effects and transitions used that add nothing and distracts from the impact, and have also seen effects and transitions that add totally to the impact. I suggest after you insert a transition or effect ask you self the simple question “does this effect/transition add to or subtract from the story or impact?”.

As a rule of thumb, most additions distract or add noise (loss of continuity) so avoid them, however don’t be frightened by adding something to gain impact. Be creative however don’t be in idiot.

To tell a story – I was in New Zealand at a glow worm cave and to entertain one group while the other was in the cave they showed a professional (ha ha) documentary all about glow worms! Evert transition was another effect, it got to the point where I was trying to second guess what the next transition would be. Visual noise – I can remember a thing about the documentary, only the transitions.

Now after the above I made a 5 min video about a hot car and I used about 10 transitions, mainly a straight cut or quick dissolve – all the other transition were used to add something in the story and it worked – I won an award for the video!

Rule are excellent guides however don’t let them stifle your creativity and don’t get carried away by adding things that take away from your work rather than add to it.

noFony wrote on 11/11/2002, 10:58 PM

I always say the more the better. If I'm not supposed to use transitions then why did they come with the program? Straight cuts are boring and dissolves are for tired old people. Wipe-squeeeze-push-spin-flash-peel-explode-zoom-disintegrate...That's what make a video exciting like those prime time news magazines. If ya don't learn to work your trannies yer never gonna make it to the big time and I don't know about you but I don't wanna cut weddings all my life! Sheesh...Get with the times people!

FuTz wrote on 11/11/2002, 11:37 PM

"the more the better"

... HHHHHHHHHaaaaaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha ha h aha ha ha ha ha ha h ah ahahah ahah ahaha ha ha ha h aha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha h aha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha a ha ha ha ha ha ha !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Do you think I could add ***more*** ?

Cheesehole wrote on 11/11/2002, 11:42 PM

>>>Wipe-squeeeze-push-spin-flash-peel-explode-zoom-disintegrate...That's what make a video exciting like those prime time news magazines.

yeah like those prime time news magazines! I mean jeez guys if you don't start working your trannies you'll be the first against the wall when the trannie revolution comes. when prime time news magazines will consist of nothing but an opening shot and a closing shot, glued together with a 30 minute long super duper mega bong hit of a 3d transition! I'm already working on mine aren't you?

DGates wrote on 11/12/2002, 1:02 AM

Your word processor comes with hundreds of fonts. When you type a letter, does every sentence need to be a different font?

TorS wrote on 11/12/2002, 2:01 AM

does every sentence need to be a different font?

These people don't write sentences. Headlines and tags rule. And they need a different font for every single letter - like in ransom notes. If we give the money to these people, they will still not give us the truth.

Tor

winrockpost wrote on 11/12/2002, 10:27 AM

kinda like 500 hp in a shelby cobra,,nice to know its there, but used with caution.

tserface wrote on 11/12/2002, 10:37 AM

That reminds me. I wish VV had a way to just change the default crossfade so that when one is dragging 100 pictures to the timeline all of the fades could be a transition different than a typical cross. For example, I did a video last night where I wanted to use a flash as the transition. It was a for a college kid friend of mine and it I used it for every transition so it looked pretty nice, but it was kind of a flash of color effect between pictures. I do know that VV remembers the most recently used transitions in the right click menu, but it sure would have been nice to just drag them up and not have to change them all. If there is a way to do this I couldn't find it. It's not a heart stopper since it only took around 10 minutes to fix it up, but it is just tedium and something that would be cool not to have to do.

Tom

Tyler.Durden wrote on 11/12/2002, 11:35 AM

Hi Tom,

You might consider using keyboard macros for that kind of stuff...

Like you said, 10 min wasn't a killer, but you might have another repetitive change that macros could be helpful with.

For tips on macros, click the link below and select... macros

HTH, MPH

<font size="-1">Tips & Contact:
http://www.martyhedler.com/homepage/Vegas_Tutorials.html

Summersond wrote on 11/12/2002, 12:15 PM

I would second Tom's idea. I often drag big amounts of pictures onto the timeline and would really like to use something other than the default dissolve.

dave

Erk wrote on 11/12/2002, 1:50 PM

Re: overdoing FX/transitions... luckily I was an audio guy before playing with video, so I got all that out of my system (I hope). You know the drill... when you got your first reverb or delay, EVERYTHING goes through it. And of course it sounded like crap.

G

bakerja wrote on 11/12/2002, 3:40 PM

"A dissolve is just a cut looking for a place to happen."

Quoting local Public TV director Charles Lewis

tserface wrote on 11/12/2002, 4:08 PM

Thanks Marty,

I've read through all of you tutorials and the RK thing does look good, I just haven't downloaded it yet. I thought it would be nice to set the transition because then you wouldn't have to change them at all after you drag all of the pictures. There are already settings for the cross fade time, clip length, etc. Perhaps this could all be done on a right click menu item with a popup dialog. For example, I select 100 pictures and right drag them the time line and have something like:

Drop Options...

on the menu. Then in that options dialog is open we could set the parameters for that one drop (like the settings in the Options/Edit tab) and select a transition (from the recently used list or drag one from the transtions tab). Then it would use those settings for all of the transitions for 100 photos or clips all at once.

Thank you for your tutorials, by the way. I have learned a lot from this forum and especially from the tutorials you and Gary, Tors, Kelly, and others, have offered. They are much appreciated.

Tom

salad wrote on 11/12/2002, 4:15 PM

One of the reasons I didn't purchase the plugin pack is cuz.....it included MORE transitions("Not...that there's anything wrong with that"). I only saw 2 fx worth using in the pack.....
Maybe next time.

john666 wrote on 11/12/2002, 5:31 PM

Transition crazy, good point, but when done well and tasty are actually cool. A few instances and the best uses I have seen in a while are in Ron Howards 'the Grinch'. While I didn't particularly care for the flick, he did some cool wipes with Christmas lights and other things.

Regards,

john

jcarney42 wrote on 11/12/2002, 6:51 PM

Dennis, oh my goodness, I used to sell those things when they came out in the mid 80s. 14k for a Mac 128, Applelaster writer and PageMaker. At that time, it was considered a bargain.