Subject:What to do after adjusting tempo to get each measure correct?

Posted by: gmay

Date:9/24/2002 12:32:03 PM

After reading Joel's excellent post on adjusting tempo for old recordings i.e. live drummers slightly out of time I have now come across something I just can't get my head round.

I have tempo marked each measure, but then should you export the whole track with tempo markers to another file or export each one measure loop to another file?

I have tried both and here is the outcome: -

COMPLETE FILE: As I am using a lot of the original track the file is a one-shot and therefore each measure of the track will only sync to other drum loops at the orig measures tempo. Which means my new project will have continuosly altering tempo.

SINGLE MEASURE LOOP: Each loop will be in sync, but suffers a lot of unwanted extras due to timestretching.

I have gone away for walks to think about this logically, mathematically, but my head is not coming up with the answers. If anyone has experience of this I am very thankful for their advice. To be honest I don't normally post questions as just reading this forum is brilliant for gaining knwoledge. You should all give yourself a pat on the back. As soon as I know more I shall try to help others myself.

Thanks

Greg

Subject:RE: What to do after adjusting tempo to get each measure correct?

Reply by: TeeCee

Date:9/24/2002 12:41:41 PM

If you are keeping the tempo close to the original, you shouldn't have so many issues with the loops sounding bad from stretching.

My advice (possibly already given) is to cut the loops up in Sound Forge. Not time stretch. Pull the loops into Acid. You are going to either have a varying tempo map, which you can still do at this point if you insert tempo changes to follow the original tempo of each loop. Or you can set a new average tempo to use for all loops. The only stretching is done on the fly for playback or rendering because your source is still untouched.

TeeCee

Subject:RE: What to do after adjusting tempo to get each measure correct?

Reply by: Iacobus

Date:9/24/2002 12:57:12 PM

Hmm... (there I go again)

If you're looking for flexibility, I'd say the single measure loop method would be best. (Are you talking about taking portions of the original project and rendering them to a new track here?)

It sounds like you're experiencing artifacting like flange and wah when stretching to tempo extremes. Do you have Sound Forge? It has some tools that lessen the impact of extreme stretching. However, it can only go so far. Anything between about 75-110% of the original tempo works well. Also, a loop always sounds better when it's speeded up rather than when it's slowed down.

The complete file method will work too, but if you plan on incorporating it with other projects, you'll have to prepare yourself for going tempo marker happy as you've noticed.

HTH,
Iacobus

Subject:RE: What to do after adjusting tempo to get each measure correct?

Reply by: gmay

Date:9/24/2002 1:13:14 PM

Thank you both. I have Soundforge, but only the version with 3(I have upgraded to ACIDPRO4). I shall try it in that, but it has limited tools or I might upgrade that also. The tempo markers is good and also changing the project to follow tempo is an idea that I didn't consider. I shall continue on this and thanks again for your excellent help.

Greg

Subject:RE: What to do after adjusting tempo to get each measure correct?

Reply by: TeeCee

Date:10/2/2002 11:14:16 AM

The version of Sound Forge from at least 4 years ago (4.0) will do all you need to do for this method as long as you don't need to use 24 bit files (which I do recommend you use, by the way). Your most important tools are ears, eyes, and markers, in about that order.

TeeCee

Subject:RE: What to do after adjusting tempo to get each measure correct?

Reply by: SonyNateM

Date:10/2/2002 11:26:40 AM

Just a tip:

If you are stretching audio in Sound Forge and you find that you are going just a bit too far with your BPM changes and strange sounds are finding their way into your loop/track, you might try splitting the change into a couple of passes. For instance, going from 120bpm to 140bpm will rarely stretch cleanly in any application. Try opening the track in Sound Forge, going to Special > Edit Tempo, specify the original BPM and hit OK. Now, use the Time Compress/Expand (Time Stretch in newer versions of SF) function to stretch it a couple times, first to 130, then to 140. I have found that this can help to reduce artifacts and give you a smoother sounding loop than doing it all in one pass.

Nate