> Also theres a grabbable volume line on each event, which when used with normalize and fades, is VERY powerful!

OK I got it. Just grab the top of the event and drag down - but this is only Gain. For instance if I had 18 songs contained in one track to write to CD it would be better to adjust each one easily UP or down to get a consistent level without using nodes. Or is the quickest way to find the quietest, adjust the entire track envelope up and the other gains down?

I couldn't get "lock envelopes to event option" to do what I wanted - the envelope was still by track.

Thanks for your help

M

Yes, the envelopes will always be per track, but with Lock Envelopes to Events switched on, when you move an event the shape you've made with the envelope over that event will move with it.
If you move the event to another track, the shape will still move with it; the destination track will automatically 'switch on' envelopes that are used in the event being copied if it needs to.

Probably the thing you have to be most careful with is making sure you have 'top and tail' Envelope Points on the edges events that you are moving, other wise strange things can happen to the envelope.... ;)

Mike K

OK, thanks for the explanation Mike, that sounds like a very useful facility. However, I think that what I am asking for may also be useful. Am I lazy or are nodes a bit of a PITA sometimes? The way Sonar works is just to have an envelope line in the middle of the whole clip/event which can be moved up or down.

Regards

M

nodes are a PITA but consider the alternative, cubendo style, where you cant even get it back to zero cuz theres no way to tell

Mus,

To clarify what Pipeline stated, each event in a track can have it's own ASR envelope, independent of the track rubber bands. Click and drag from the top edge of an event for gain. Click and drag from the upper right corner of an event for a fade out. Click and drag from the upper left of an event for a fade it. Right click a fade in or fade out to change the envelope velocity type. Note that this is now part of the event. These "personal" envelopes stay with the event wherever it's moved.

If you'd like the track-wide envelopes to function the same way, you have to make sure that the points (the little blue squares) are touching or on top of the event your automating (usually the edit points will snap right to the event). Then make sure you have the "lock envelope points to events" option enabled. Now the edit point can be dragged along with the event, and even cut and pasted with it too.

Hope this helps,
Nick LaMartina

Thanks Nick.

Well I see what you mean about "lock envelope points to events" but, unless I am misunderstanding, the fiddly bit would be creating nodes exactly at the beginning and end of each event, and at the same volume, so that the envelope could be raised or lowered. I still think that a separate event envelope would be useful.

Regards

M

I agree that creating two nodes can sometimes be a bit fiddly, though I'm not sure if a separate event envelope would work.

I've always thought it would be good if you could create two side-by-side nodes with a single key stroke, or perhaps by an option in the right-click dialog, or even by triple clicking.

In the past I've used to Pro Tools and, as far as I can remember, if you selected the equivalent of the Envelope Edit Tool and highlighted a selection that contained no nodes, by simply lowering or raising the envelope, nodes would be automatically created. Very handy...

Ben

M,

Creating nodes at the exact beginning and end shouldn't be a hassle as long as you've got snapping enabled. They should naturally snap right to the edges of event so long as you're in the general area. Furthermore, if you need more exact node placement, simply right-click and select "Set To" to enter it manually (I believe that's what it's called, Vegas is in my other OS). Another thing you could do is start with a 0.0 dB line, add two points, snap to the edges, add two more points inside those, and drag the inner line up and down. This way everything stays constant. There are other ways to accomplish this, but with a bit of messing around you should find a way that suits your needs.

Regards,
Nick

All this is exactrly why CD Architect is just so much more the appropriate place for this sort of thing.

> with a bit of messing around you should find a way that suits your needs.

My suggestion is designed to avoid all this messing around with creating 36 nodes for an 18 event compilation.

How about it SoFo?

M

Can you clarify something: are the per-event evelopes just for level/gain changes, or things like pan too. Do they have nodes, or are they just a single, grabable up and down control?

I can see per event envelopes conflicting with the track length envelopes to a degree - assuming they default to the horizontal centre of the event, they'd be hidden as soon as you added a track length envelope. This would then take even more work moving the track envelope out of the way, before you could change the event envelope.

hhhmmm.... personally I'm not convinced this is a 'must have' feature.

To repeat suggestions from previous posts - Normalize the clips and use the gain control from the top edge of the events.

You can Normalize multiple clips at the same time:
1)Make your selection of events by
a] Use the selection tool to select muliple events
b] for a single track, click on the first event on a track, right click and choose "select events to end"
c] For every event in the project, use Ctrl+A to select EVERYTHING!
2) Right click on any of the selected events, go to 'switches' and choose Normalize.

Mike K

and while I'm here.....

QUOTE "...For instance if I had 18 songs contained in one track to write to CD it would be better to adjust each one easily UP or down to get a consistent level without using nodes. Or is the quickest way to find the quietest, adjust the entire track envelope up and the other gains down? "

You could do it the old fasioned way - put every song on a seperate track, and use the mixer controls in the left of the window.... crude but effective!

I personally fnd the Volume Envelope pretty quick to use. If you hold down shift, you only have to single click to add nodes. You can drag a node as soon as it is created - so you hold shift, click and drag the node, release the mouse button and repeat as desired.

Mike K

Well, guys all I'm really asking for is that the event gain defaults to 0.0 in the middle of the event so that it can be dragged up, not just down. So no big confusion factor. That's how Sonar works, anyway. They also have an event Pan envelope as well as track.

Regards

M

I'd really like to see an envelope paint tool - one that would allow you to draw the envelope with a pencil tool.

What I'ld like to see is to be able to add nodes to the "event envelope" and also to be able to set a default fade type to these evelopes, instead of having to right click and change the fade type all the time. This is because, sometimes I need to copy an event with volume changes, but I need to alter the mix (ie level) as it appears in a different part of a song. So if I had the ability to add nodes to the event envelope, I could adjust the mixing part differently with the "volume envelope". Thus, I would have the best of both worlds, and this might even solve your problem.

BTW, You can use the "envelope edit" tool to select a group of nodes and the selected nodes will all move together, if you want to raise they're volume up or down.

"I'd really like to see an envelope paint tool - one that would allow you to draw the envelope with a pencil tool"

Yup, with you there. Touch automation would be v.cool too.

Important distinction between event and track envelopes - event ones are Pre-inserts, track ones are post inserts (this isn't a suggestion - it's how it currently works).

Mike K