Please Help With Audio Problem

craftech wrote on 8/20/2002, 1:52 PM
Hi,
I haven't done anything with the audio in Vegas until now and I am having a problem. I did a Bar Mitzvah in which the Rabbi and the family were speaking in a very low voice during the pre-ceremony conference in the Rabbi's chambers. That section is on the timeline right now, but I can't seem to raise the audio level in only that section. I have read the help section on audio envelopes and also on normalization, but whatever I do seems to affect the entire timeline instead of the sections I want it to apply to. Any suggestions?

John

Comments

Chienworks wrote on 8/20/2002, 2:15 PM
Whatever effect you try (and normalization is probably a good one to start with), make sure you apply it to only that event. Right mouse click on the event itself and from the popup menu that appears choose Switches > Normalize. This will normalize just that event.

To apply other processing effects to only that event, click on that event to select it, then click Tools / Audio / Insert Assignable FX for real-time effects, or Apply Non Real-Time Event FX to process the event immediately and create a new take with the effect applied.

If you are clicking the effect chain icon in the track header then you are applying the effect to the entire track and all the clips it contains.
jthor wrote on 8/20/2002, 2:20 PM
Seems like they provided a sample of lowering part of an envelope in their very first manual sample. Should be able to duplicate that but raise it. I shall be watching with interest cause I am just about at that beginners stage myself. I always practice with a copied file and develop my own test .veg files to figure out the technique and get a sample. good luck
craftech wrote on 8/20/2002, 3:20 PM
OK, here's what I tried:
I set markers at the beginning and end of the section I wanted to normalize. I clicked on the audio track within that section and it highlighted. I right clicked
and chose switches/normalize. The audio in that section collapsed to zero....no audio at all. It amazes me that there are people who actually call this program "intuitive". What did I do wrong?

I also tried selecting that section and choosing Apply Non Real-Time Event FX. I tried amplitude modulation and slid the slider up to increase amplitude. Then it asked me to save it with a file name. Seemed like the wrong thing to do so I didn't.

John
SonyDennis wrote on 8/20/2002, 3:58 PM
craftech:

Normalize shouldn't have made the audio any quieter, so I don't know what you are seeing there.

Normalize is per event, so you could split the event at that section and just normalize the part of it that is quiet.

But perhaps the best solution is to use a volume envelope. Right-click on the track icon for that track, select "insert / remove envelope" and pick "volume.". Create "nodes", two before and two after the quiet section, then drag up on the line between them. This will raise the volume for that section. The distance of the node pairs determines the fade time before and after the "lifted" section.

More info is in the manual and help.

///d@
craftech wrote on 8/20/2002, 5:38 PM
OK, here is what I have done so far:

I followed SonicDennis' advice. I found out that you cannot insert an audio envelope only in the section of the timeline where you want to change it. You have to insert the envelope across the entire timeline. Then I searched the index in the help file for "nodes" and it didn't list the term. I read the section on inserting envelope "points" and deduced that those must be the "nodes". I inserted two points in front of the section I wanted to raise the volume for and two after. Then I raised the envelope to its maximum level and there was a marginal increase in the volume. You could at least understand what they were saying. The distance between the points at the beginning sets the fade in time and the two at the end set the fade out time.
Thank you Dennis.

PS: Is there any way to increase it even further?

John
SeanC wrote on 8/20/2002, 9:45 PM
you may also try plugging in a compressor and setting the threshold fairly low to bring up all levels. You may have to raise the output of the compressor if it has that option to make up the difference. This *will* also increase background noise, but can be VERY useful for getting levels into a useable area.

Chances are the normalize is working, however there is probably a strong peak during the entire region that is getting treated to the 100% level and leaving everything else on the floor. You may get better results by splitting the region a few times and normalize each section.

try www.db-audioware.com if you need a cheap but good set of tools. $99 for a kit, $39 or so for compressor only. They're solid tools.

Sean

craftech wrote on 8/21/2002, 7:11 AM
Thanks,

John
craftech wrote on 8/21/2002, 7:30 PM
I tried splitting into small sections and normalizing. It still collapses to zero with no peaks of any kind within that section. I am using w98SE..and vv3a...maybe it's that.
It was once before in terms of the HSL filter.
I also downloaded the trial version of db-audioware's tools suite, but I was afraid to use it because it seems that it does destructive changes to the audio instead of non-destructive changes (virtual). Please correct me if I am wrong.

John
SeanC wrote on 8/21/2002, 8:09 PM
when you plug in a direct x plugin on the track, it will process it on the fly and not destroy the original audio AFAIK.

I can confirm this on the main mix audio track, maybe someone can comment on individual tracks.

That said, you CAN get it to do destructive audio processing of individual regions, but I believe it wants to allow you to save it to a different name. I'll try it tomomrrow when I get into the office, maybe someone can comment in the meantime?

Sean
craftech wrote on 8/23/2002, 11:35 AM
Can anyone confirm this?

John
SonyDennis wrote on 8/23/2002, 12:55 PM
Vegas doesn't overwrite your media. The Track FX, Bus FX, and Assignable FX are all realtime, the Non-Realtime FX are applied to a copy of the audio and then created as an Event "Take" which can be flipped back to the original (for comparison or whatever) with a keystroke ("T"). If you haven't played with Takes, they're pretty useful, look them up in the help or manual.
///d@
DougHamm wrote on 8/23/2002, 1:27 PM
I have seen in the past a bug in Vegas that, under the right circumstances, would completely silence a clip that had the normalize switch turned on. This goes back a ways (you might search the forums) and I thought the bug was squashed in previous updates to Vegas. Are you using 3.0c?

-Doug
craftech wrote on 8/23/2002, 9:05 PM
No, I am using 3.0a

John
SonyEPM wrote on 8/26/2002, 9:05 AM
Craftech: Please update to Vegas 3.0c- the normalize bug you describe has been fixed.
SonyEPM wrote on 8/26/2002, 9:06 AM
Craftech: Please update to Vegas 3.0c- the normalize bug you describe has been fixed. See the 3.0c readme file if you want a comprehensive bug-fix list.
craftech wrote on 8/26/2002, 9:04 PM
Thanks......will do
a_v wrote on 8/26/2002, 9:20 PM
hi john

i have fixed these probs before...

normalize > waves noise removal plugin > waves L1 limiter

i can get almost perfect results.

if your trying to make a living doing this stuff, youre best off visiting www.waves.com

there are no better plugins....some come close, but just not the same.
craftech wrote on 8/27/2002, 11:17 AM
VV 3.0c did the trick. Had to split the track in two places each time I wanted to normalize portions. Came out much louder than the method I tried above without having to esort to plugins. The "waves" plugins look really useful, but are pretty expensive. Maybe in the future.

John