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Subject:Using SoundForge for Acid Loop Calculations
Posted by: Vocalpoint
Date:5/21/2002 11:41:35 AM

All,

Just getting into some big time loop editing with SF6. Here's the layout: I have converted an audio only CD into a series of .wav files. (about 50 separate files) This audio CD is nothing but drum loops that need some TLC to get them playing nice in ACID. My current process goes like this:

1. Select first audio clip (as close to start as SF can select it) and go to Edit Tempo.
2. Play around with the selection length until the loop timing is correct and the downbeat is tight. Apply Selection length and close Tempo Dialog.
3. Hit Shift-R to create a region
4. Move onto the next clip and repeat until I have the clip full of regions.
5. Choose Tools-Extract Regions
6. Have a folder full of loops ready for Acid etc...

Couple of questions that I have:

1. Is there a way to have SF copy/retain/reapply a selection length? I find that once I find the "magic" selection length for my first loop phrase, I use the same length over and over and having to input it (through the Tempo dialog) for 40 or 50 phrases is a huge hassle.

2. Can SF automatically detected the next sample in the window? What I would like to do here is avoid having to zoom in so close to find the absolute start point of the next phrase as I move from phrase to phrase/region to region. In my case, all of these files have absolute silence between them so a keyboard shortcut that would automagically set the selection start would be most excellent as a time saver.

3. Is this the same method others are using to create Acid Loops from Forge? Just wanna know how you would tackle this kind of edit or is there a better/faster way?

Cheers,

Cuzin B

Subject:RE: Using SoundForge for Acid Loop Calculations
Reply by: ATP
Date:5/22/2002 3:57:13 AM

1. i think you should be able to lock the region markers. so, if you've placed the markers for your first loop to your liking, lock them and then drag them around. you'll notice the length between the markers is fixed now, so it's only a question of finding the proper start of the next loop.

2. no idea. sorry.

3. i have been making loops for years and i've got about 10 Gb of original, self sampled loops in my library now. all have been made using Sound Forge, and all have been made using the method you described : find a good loop, use regions to isolate it, and then extract regions. because i've been doing this for so long i've come to the point where i will almost automatically find the exact right spot for start and finish. so i can make loops relatively easy and quick. it's a matter of reading the shape of the wave file, really.
i don't know if there's a better way to make loops, other than buying them from somebody who has already done all the work for you (i'm thinking about those SF Loop Library shit). but then, do you want original stuff that only you can find on some old 12" record, or do you want mass produced, flat loops without soul? i didn't think so. ;)

Subject:RE: Using SoundForge for Acid Loop Calculations
Reply by: ATP
Date:5/22/2002 4:00:30 AM

oh btw,

i don't get why you need to use the Edit Tempo feature. when i make a loop i just listen to where it should end. and if the tempo is off it doesn't matter, since ACID will stretch the loop to fit anyway.

so, i'm curious as what you're trying to do with the Edit Tempo function. :)

Subject:RE: Using SoundForge for Acid Loop Calculations
Reply by: Vocalpoint
Date:5/22/2002 6:51:59 AM

ATP,

Thanks for your update...most excellent. Regarding your third commnent regarding edit tempo - in the eraly going for this project I did exactly as you said - just built a region by ear...listened a bit for a good loop point/downbeat and then created my region. That was cool until I brought a bunch of stuff into Acid. On almost all of the "best guess loops" I would get a flanging sound for most of the loops since the selection length was slightly off.

Then I went to one of my SF Loop disks and did a little experimenting...first thing I noticed is that all the file lengths were identical - so I went to Edit Tempo...entered a selection length that was identical for a loop series and like magic - no more flanging.

Acid is great at stretching and accomodating different files but this flanging noise was annoying....

Also I noticed that for the most part - the sonic foundry loop stuff is all locked in a tempo of 120 and 4 beat measures...I can't seem to figure out how to make my loops more consistant like that but I am working on it...any more tips would be helpful...

Cheers,

Cuzin B

Subject:RE: Using SoundForge for Acid Loop Calculations
Reply by: ATP
Date:5/23/2002 3:10:06 AM

ah, yes i know what you mean with the flangy sound. that has happened to me occasionally as well, but not very often. i guess i have been lucky then. :) a lot of samples i take are not very tight to begin with, so that leaves me room to toy around with them in ACID. if a loop doesn't quite fit to a beat for example, i may set it to Disk Based and fool around with the Stretch from Tempo setting. usually this does the trick.

as for getting loops at *exactly* the same length, i wouldn't know how to program such a thing in SF. if you had to try to achieve this by using your ear, it would only work with a source that is tight to the point of constipation. ;) if you do find out how to make SF do it for you, please post it, as i'm sure others besides me are interested.

good luck!

Subject:RE: Using SoundForge for Acid Loop Calculations
Reply by: Vocalpoint
Date:5/23/2002 6:52:10 AM

ATP,

The only way that I have been able to do this is with Edit Tempo. If the selection length is identical each time then off course the region will be too. Whenyou extract regions - all files will be the same length.

I would be grateful if Sonic Foundry could explain how their engineers tackle a Loops for Acid Project. In specific - how do they mark and extract their loop clips from a raw tape/file? How about it SF?

Cheers,

Cuzin B

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